Here’s a question for you, based on a column I’m writing for The Bark magazine. The editors asked if I’d write a column about “training old dogs.” (The column on training male versus female dogs will be in the next issue… stay tuned!). The question: how does your training vary (or does it?) once your dog becomes geriatric? I’ve started the column already: “Lassie doesn’t sit anymore, at least, not when asked.” I’m basing this introduction on the fact that about six months ago, my 15 year old Lassie looked at me blankly when I asked her to sit.
She’s going deaf, so I thought perhaps she didn’t hear me. I gave her our usual visual signal. Nothing. Then I lured her down with a piece of food. She looked up at my eyes and stared at me. And rather than trying any longer, I thought: “Oh, I get it. Either it hurts her to sit (she’s named Lassie for a reason after all, and basically did everything and anything anyone asked for 14 years) or she’s just simply done performing now that she’s the equivalent of a 90 year old woman. Sort of the canine equivalent of “When I am old I will wear purple.”
Here’s the thing. I treated it completely differently than if it had been Willie. Basically, although I’m still teaching Lassie some new things, which I think is good for her, I’m giving her a lot of ‘old dog’ passes. She is almost deaf, losing her sight, playful but frail and I suspect that her mind feels a little fuzzy sometimes. What do you think? Do you give your old dogs ‘passes’ too?
On the home front, it was 10 below this morning and windy. I’m going to keep this short because Lassie was so cold outside I’m not sure she even peed last time I took her out. I’m going to run home to let her out again. Thank heavens I got in and out of Washington DC between storms. It is absurd here… 10 inches Friday (totally snowed out of my office, couldn’t even think about leaving the farm), more the day after and now they’re predicting a total of another 13″ in the next two days. Geeeez. Being on the Diane Rehm show as without question the highlight of the month. I unabashedly adore her, although I realize such praise is terrifically uncool (“don’t gush” a producer said to me once). She is the best interviewer I’ve ever worked with, and the fact that she was such a supporter of my radio show is a great compliment indeed. Here’s a photo of her and her Maxie, who amused us all by playing with the toy I’d brought while we did the show.
And here’s Will, who unlike me and Lassie, seems oblivious to the cold. Ah youth!
Alexia says
Alexia Says:
December 22nd, 2008 at 1:26 pm
To Trisha: Thank you for responding to my desperate post earlier this month, about my new dog Lily and her territoriality with Scout, the part-time-in-residence border collie. Since then, an acquaintance in Boise(who is totally devoted to her 2 border collies; her mother has talked with you in WI) recommended The Other End of the Leash, and reading that has made a HUGE difference for me. My Lily has improved dramatically (partly because I
mcappy says
oh great question. can’t wait to read the responses. My own 10 yr old has started to “stand” and wag when I ask for a sit. She still comes, shakes and responds well to verbal and visual cues. Sit = Eyes and mouth happy and eager but still standing. Visual hand signal does nothing either. Still standing. One of my other dogs is blind/deaf and responds to touch….so I tried re-training with touch commands. I know she has some arthritis back leg issues and even as a younger dog preferred to stand or lie down vs doing the prolonged sit…but would sit when asked.
Touch commands are nice but this is also a dog that is not 100% onleash like the other one. So I’ve given her the old dog pass on “sit” but I have been retraining her with touch commands….just in case that curiously enough….she’s learning happily.
Claudia says
I taught me neighbor’s old dogs some tricks. He stays with us when they’re out of town, and I included him in Ginger’s nightly trick sessions. He was a natural. He learned sit, shake, and down right away and now we’re working on play dead and roll over. I also built some hurdles for them out of PVC pipe and on the command “jump” Ginger jumps over and he, well, crawls under, because he’s built a bit low to the ground.
He so loves his trick sessions, it’s as though he’s waited for it all his life: “finally, someone is teaching me some useful stuff!” He now comes over to my place, knocks on the door, and when I open, goes through his whole repertoire right there on the porch, sitshakesitdownshakesitshakesitdown – it’s the wildest thing 🙂
Katie says
When I adopted my last old dog Harvey, he didn’t seem to know anything except sit, so I enrolled him in a beginners obedience class. He was a sweet, gentle old man but a few bricks short (if you know what I mean). He also turned out to be terrified of the clicker. We left class with him knowing oh one or two more things than he knew when we started, but a good time was had by all (after they got rid of those eeeevil clickers!) and that was the bottom line.
I’ve not yet had a dog from youth to old age (my young dogs are six now) but I’ve had two old dogs that came to me old. They got a lot of free passes, but I definitely noticed with Harvey especially that once I asked him to start using his brain a little bit, he got a lot smarter in general. It was really a cool thing to see.
Denise says
Yes, my old dogs get ‘passes’. Age should have some privileges!
Even my not so old dog (approx 10 yrs) with hip dysplasia gets ‘passes’ on sitting to go in/out or on halfhearted attempts at a requested ‘trick’, since it could be because her hips are bothering her, I give her the benefit of the doubt.
Holly says
My oldest right now is 12. She does not act like a senior citizen yet, but I am still very aware she is not the spry youngster she once was and I am careful of her. She does not go out with the wild young male dog(s), she has access to my bed at her whim and she gets to eat in peace without the worry of other dogs being near her.
I still do ask her to do a few things as she does still like to work, but we do not attempt things that are strenuous, or hard for her to do.
I found a few weeks ago, that I am uber protective of her too. One of the younger dogs had a melt down moment and thought she might re-direct on my old girl….I am *still* not over that and the younger dog can live in a crate when I cannot be right there to supervise. Not even 5 minutes without my direct attention will happen btween these two again.
Casey says
My old dogs have all gotten passes depending on what kinds of disabilities they had.
My last Lab, Hershey, had very bad arthritis in his knees and lower spine and then had a couple of acute attacks of vestibular disease from which he never fully recovered. He was able to stand up and lie down but his last couple of years he didn’t sit at all. In our house I’ve always expected an auto sit before opening the door or setting down food bowls. In his younger days Hershey was very quick to comply and if he “forgot” a slight, throat clearing “ahem” from me would cause him to shuffle back a bit and plop his butt down. After he quit sitting, though, an “ahem” (which he could hear) wouldn’t even cause the backward shuffle. It’s pure speculation on my part but it seemed to me that Hershey didn’t even realize his back end wasn’t going down. Maybe the encroaching arthritis was also causing some nerve damage? He continued to comply with commands for things that he could do right up until his last few days.
My current Lab is eight so verging on senior status. She’s getting a bit grey around the chops and isn’t as fond of cold and snow as she once was but we’re still clicking and treating and she keeps learning new tricks. I’ll keep up the training with her as long as she continues to enjoy it.
RubyLotus says
Hello Trisha, just so you know, I’m as big a fan of you as you are of Diane R. and I loved the interview. (Gushing now stopped.) Which DVD I should order (first)? I’ve suddenly met someone important and might be moving after creating a cosy predictable den life (upstairs 1 BR condo) with two rescue purebred toys who came as a pair (Pap + Pom 4ever). We have come comfortably to the point of 2 medium plus one short walks each day and rare crate-soiling overnight (upon food changes mostly). They sit and wait fairly well but are pretty much in constant motion after being released. (It would be easy to teach them to “Be bad” as that behavior is frequently offered despite my reinforcing sacked-out lounging.) Someone New does not understand dogs and I think the pups might be jealous about his getting attention and being allowed on the Forbidden Sofa and in Boss’ Private Rooms. Last night was same-food Pom hurling, howling, crate-soiling (Pap too), water-soaking and theatrical but not at all vigorous spanking. And two hours’ sleep.
Kerry L. says
Alice, my cattle-dog mix who was trained to Open level, stopped obeying commands, both verbal and hand signals, around age 11. When the rest of the dogs were sitting for their supper, Alice was standing quietly, waving her tail. She got lots of ‘passes’ because she was so sweet and never got into any trouble. She could no longer hear me when I called but Walter the Corgi was more than willing to go round her up with his piercing bark. I believe she had CCD because around the same time she stopped listening to commands, she started getting ‘lost’ when off leash at the dog park. The only thing she remembered reliably was to come when signaled (maybe she just wanted to be near me). I once adopted an elderly chihuahua who never even learned his name, much less to come when called or to sit or lie down. However, he was attached to my housemate and followed her wherever she went around the house and stood like a sentry when she sat down to rest. Kerry
Kelly Ladouceur says
I made a lot of mistakes when I trained my first dog (now 9). He was a show dog, and everybody told me that you can’t train show dogs in obedience, or you’ll ruin them. Baloney! But back then I didn’t know any better, and I barely trained this dog until he was almost 2. Then when I did start training him, I used jerk and tug methods, which he wasn’t fond of (Cocker Spaniels are pretty soft). We had some negative experiences, but once we found the right instructor, we had some pretty darned good experiences too. The thing is, I allowed sloppy sits, poor fronts and all other sorts of small inadequacies (for lack of a better word at the moment). Now, when I’m a better trainer and looking for more “perfection” in my up and comers, I see all of those mistakes I made with Farley. But . . . he’s 9. And he’s happy, mistakes and all. We earned our titles (everything we set out for, he earned), so he gets a lot of old dog passes now, even though he’s not really that old.
I still train him to do tricks, and we’ve gotten into Rally obedience (limited, due to his bad knees and bad back), but I won’t ever push him for straight sits and perfect fronts and finishes. I don’t know if I could “re-wire” him at this point. And why add potential stress to his life? His competitive career is over – the most he does is act as a demo dog for the classes I teach, and he’s good enough to get the point across to my students (they’re also learning which things are very important, based on my own past mistakes).
Personally, I think Lassie’s at the age where a small amount of civil disobedience is allowable – and I get the drift from your post that you do too.
Susan says
When Pepper (beagle mix) was old, he got quite a few passes- I let him participate in an agility seminar at age 11 to give my other dog a break, and was berated for not “maintaining my criteria” until I told them he was almost 12! My oldest dog now, Brodie (BC), is 10 and still exuberant, but started to not hold his contact behavior, and I’m figuring this is due to it being physically uncomfortable, so I’m trying to figure how to retrain him over the winter, or whether to just give up and only run him in jumpers. I started allowing running off the contact, but now the behavior has degraded to completely jumping over the contact zone (and in his last trial before I pulled him, he jumped from the second slat on the dogwalk- a pretty big leap for an older dog!)He still is totally gung-ho for agility (and the rest of life!) so I don’t want to give it up completely. And my sports vet-chiropractor doesn’t find anything too out of whack, though of course some arthritis is probably present. But 10 doesn’t seem that old, at least for him, so although he gets away with a bit, and I snuggle more with him on the couch, he’s not getting too many passes, in part because he needs a fair amount of control and stimulation or he start acting out (growling at my other dogs, trying to control their movements in the house, reacting to innocuous noises). I have, however, been encouraging him up onto the sofa more. Kyp!, on the other hand, is slightly younger, (I think, don’t really know, and maybe she’s really older!) but is grayer, lazier, and more mellow, and I’ve been letting her get away with murder for the past year or so (she turns 10 in february, though its a made-up birthday). I only occasionally compete with her, ’cause she’s not that interested in it and never has been, though she likes to get out and play on the agility equipment with me- but play is the operative word. She’s absolutely adorable now with her white eyelashes outlining her eyes, how can I not look at her and just agree with whatever she’s asking?
trisha says
Yes, I do indeed allow some ‘civil disobedience’ (love that phrase in this context!). I even laugh when Lassie sticks her nose in my dinner plate, after never coming anywhere near food on the low table in the living room until just recently. I am not so generous as to share my food while I’m still eating it, so I gently move her nose aside, but I do it laughing (hey, she can’t hear me, don’t say I’m reinforcing her!)
I just sent in my Bark column on this topic, and ended with segments of the famous poem, When I am Old I Will Wear Purple by Jenny Joseph:
. . .When I am an old woman
I shall wear purple – –
With a red hat which doesn
Rebecca Golatzki says
Interesting that I happened on this blog and this post as this topic has weighed heavily on my mind lately…my “heart dog” is 11 1/2 now and age is creeping up on him; I have spent the last year trying not to be in denial that there will soon be a day when he must be officially “retired”. Time slips by so fast and we had so many different games to play; I put off a lot of things thinking there would be time later and they would be good old age activities. Agility is our first love; he is so much faster than I and our Q rate is terrible, but I always thought he would slow down as he aged and we could focus on Qs then and just have fun in the meantime. The irony….he lost his hearing before he slowed down in the least and the past year we have had days where he ran just like always, and days where the hearing loss really compromised us. Two days ago he started to cough just a little, and yesterday I found a new and pretty loud heart murmur he had not had before (although if i am honest in my heart of hearts I suspected his cardiac function was decreasing just by little things i saw after a run). I think that means his competition days in agility are over; he STILL puts his all into every run and i am afraid his brave little heart can’t handle the strain. We need one more utility leg and we will focus on that; it has been a BIG challenge as just as all the pieces started to fall together for us in the obedience ring his hearing started to go. It has affected him in ways I would not have anticipated (especially in the huge increase in his barking, which, being a sheltie, had been an issue at times anyway). I also do notice definite “senior moments”; he is not as quick to put two and two together and has lost his tolerance for prolonged periods of mental concentration (I am sure decreased O2 flow from his heart is a factor here as well). I also have found both with him and my previous dog that around 10 years old “stay” became progressively more and more optional. A little might be due to indulgence on my part, but I also think decreasing sight and vision play a role- with Andy i find it is also harder to release him from a stay because he is not picking up the cues as well, so i think the end result is similar to if I had not consistently been giving a clear release- he starts to release himself. I did start him on denosyl
(primarily used for beneficial effects on liver) when i read some info suggesting it might be helpful for cognitive dysfunction, and i do think it has helped.
My previous dog did not start training in agility until he was 9 and had his UDX; he was 10 at his first trial and got his NA NAJ, and two OA legs before retiring at almost 12 (also due to hearing loss); I brought him back out at 14 in veterans a few times and he did very well. He lived to almost 17. I do think it is important with the old dogs to continue training at some level or they deteriorate very quickly both mentally and physically. I think it is difficult to separate the physical from the mental issues as they are so intertwined. Andy and I will keep working on that UD and continue to train in tracking and maybe do a little more rally; he still WANTS to be the number one dog in the training order and I still love to work him.
Oh, for a fountain of youth!
Trisha says
I think Rebecca’s comment about the difficulty of separating out mental and physical decline is a great point. Certainly its true that brain function is just as physical as ‘body’ function (it is SO interesting to me that our culture has always separating these two out. Descartes, among others, still has an amazing impact on our thinking even now.) but I do think the overall point of “is a dog doing or not doing something because his or her muscles/bones can’t anymore, or because cognitively he/she can’t or doesn’t want to? It is truly hard to separate out.
Speaking of old dogs, Lassie has started urinating in the house again. She’s battled bladder infections for awhile, and I thought one had come back, but it doesn’t look like it. (Although I’m treating her for it anyway, just in case!) My vet and I were talking yesterday that perhaps, at fifteen, she just can’t hold it so well anymore (I don’t leave her for more than 5 hours if at all possible) OR, maybe she just doesn’t care that much either? As long as she doesn’t need treatment, I frankly don’t care all that much. I’d rather not come home to urine on the floor, but at least she goes on the dining room tile where it’s easy to clean up. Heck, I went through a year where both Tulip and Pippy were defecating in the house (all health and age related) on a daily basis (the year of 2.5 vet appts a week for over 9 months, I kid you not). This is nothing!
Here’s to your Andy, and to all our elderly dogs.
Sabine says
I came to the conclusion that old dogs train us. Period.
All the dogs who have accompanied me through my life have gotten away with murder once they got older. Also gave me a good excuse to spoil them a little. Guilty as charged. :)))
BTW – this is a cute little poem about old dogs:
http://doyourememberlove.com/narration.html
It gives me goosebumps every time…..
Michael Gross says
The juxtaposition in the title and content of this blog entry makes me wonder whether anyone out there perceives Diane Rehm to be an old bitch. I can write such a sentence only because sustained appreciation of her broadcasts almost always makes me feel exactly the opposite, and transient experiences of impatience or irritation [when I don’t like the way a conversation happens to be going because it violates my pet presumptions] are the only moments when I can imagine listeners who disrespect or otherwise have adverse feelings about her work.
Her inteview with Dr. McConnell is perfect example of why I listen to her broadcast regularly. It elucidated the work and it revealed the person who undertook it, with grace, intelligence, warmth, and candor. That first exposure to Dr. McConnell opened a vast world to me by opening a path that has, since then, exposed me to a variety of thinkers and writers about animal behavior in general and dog training and co-evolution with humans in particular. It also led me to listen to more than a year’s worth of “Calling All Pets” and deeply lament its cancellation.
I’ll fail at fully enumerating the reasons I have come to admire Dr. McConnell’s work as a result of those podcasts and, now, beginning to delve into her books. Those that spring to mind include:
– Few scientists/researchers can so enthusiastically and lucidly assimilate and present leading edge research to lay audiences, give a comprehensive account of the methods and findings, and in so doing motivate further curiosity rather than “oh, OK, fine, that’s interesting, so what else is new?”
– It’s impossible to enumerate, even estimate, the number of times Dr. McConnell’s kindness, warmth, spontaneity, creativity, and vivid recall for past experience amazed me. Speaking of grace, especially under pressure, her real time responses to a myriad of listener issues never failed to amaze me, especially in the extent to which she grounded practical advice in both experience and, when pertinent, compelling research results.
– Many scientists, maybe most, succumb to the notion that “objectivity” is violated by frank expression of their passion for the work they do, and that self-disclosure should be kept rigorously separate from anything related to their scientific work. The only other scientist who comes to mind — and I consider this high praise — as representing a similar blend of authentic self and personal motivations with credible and respected scientific productivity is Kay Redfield Jamison, the Johns Hopkins University authority on bipolar disorder.
– The “softer” the science, and the more a field is dominated by males who are most comfortable in the wolfpack pecking-order social order [when they’re alpha, at any rate], the more one’s ego and confidence can be buffeted. If Dr. McConnell has experienced such patterns in her career, her zest for the work shows no traces of such struggles. Her remarks about the cancellation of the WPR program during that interview displayed, I thought, both her genuine and amply justified regret and her resiliency.
To fill the gap left by racing through those archived podcasts, I turned to Jon Katz’ “Dog Talk” discussions (and books) but, as with any important loss, nothing can substitute for the absence of future “Calling All Pets” episodes.
Trisha says
I have to admit when I first read Michael’s post I got a little worried when ‘bitch’ and Diane Rehm came up in the same sentence. Then I got the joke and laughed out loud at the title I had created to designate two different topics (old dogs, diane rehm). I couldn’t agree more with Michael that Diane is a class act all around, and that her shows are consistently insightful and stimulating. And how can I not thank Michael for his kind words about me? They are sincerely appreciated. Talk about generosity and warmth! I am considering copying his gracious words for low moments, and perhaps flashing them in front of friends or colleagues in those moments when I begin to appear all-too-humanly irritating or tiresome.