I’ve been intrigued lately by a breed of dog called the Carolina Dog. These dogs have been in the news lately, because a study of the genetics of the domestic dog suggested that several of the American dog breeds (Chihuahua for example) have origins from ancient Asian breeds rather more recent European ones. The study, c0mparing mitochondrial DNA, suggested that Carolina dogs are quite accurately called “American Dingos,” because of a close genetic relationship to the same genetic pool that created Australian Dingos. Both dogs appeared to have originated from dogs in East Asia rather than having genetics more closely related to European breeds.
Carolina Dogs certainly look a lot like Dingos, and they also fit the drawings and descriptions from Native American Indians long before Europeans settled the country. Some suggest that they migrated from Asia over the Bering Land Bridge as many as 20,000 years ago. Fossil evidence also suggests a connection, which is why the dogs are also sometimes called North American Native Dogs and Indian Dogs. Here’s a photo from Wikipedia (who, by the way, I contribute to each month because it is such a great resource). Note that they aren’t all colored this way, some are actually black and tan, as apparently are some dingos. (Australian readers, feel free to confirm or deny.)
Carolina dogs received national attention in the 1970’s when an ecologist, Dr. I. Lehr Brisbin became curious about them while doing studies in the Savannah River area of South Carolina. The dogs were living in an 310 square mile area managed by the Department of Energy which was closed to the public due to the production of nuclear materials. It is suspected that the remoteness of the area allowed the dogs to avoid inter-mixing with other types of dogs and thus retain their more “ancient” genetics. (But question: What about all those years before the area was closed? Why wouldn’t the dogs have bred with more dogs of European breeding? Apparently not, and probably because the area is basically swamp, and thus is truly isolated.) Brisbin first assumed the dogs were “just strays,” but did some investigating and began to realize that the dogs more resembled Dingos than the usual American free-ranging dog.
After they were discovered to represent an ancient breed, many of the dogs were captured and a captive breeding program was begun. Carolina dogs are now a registered breed of the United Kennel Club and the American Rare Breed Association.
All of this brings up a number of questions, I’ve listed the easiest (and silliest) one first:
Was “Old Yeller” a Carolina Dog? Old Yeller is still one of my favorite books in the entire world, although I also still can’t read it without turning into a puddle. If you haven’t read it you are in for a treat; it is a beautifully written book. It never occurred to me while reading it that the dog in the book could have been a Carolina Dog, but now I find myself wondering… After all, some sources say that Carolina dogs were called “yaller dogs” by the locals. (Question to South Carolina readers: Does “yaller dog” just translate to “yellow dogs?”) The descriptions of Old Yeller seem to fit the descriptions of Carolina dogs (loyal but also independent, good with children but avid hunters, etc.). I’ll have to go back and dig out my old copy.
What is it like to live with a Carolina Dog, or any other “non-domesticated” breed of dog, like New Guinea Singing Dogs or Basenjis? Keep in mind that I have some experience with these breeds, and have good friends who own them. Thus, I have my own opinions, but I’ll wait to hear from readers before chiming in.
Unique Bathroom Behavior? I called Brisbin last week after reading about the study on the genetics of “American” dogs, and found that, according to him, Carolina dogs exhibit two unique behaviors that are as distinctive as any structure or morphology. For one thing, 98% of the females create “snout pits,” or depressions in the sand formed exactly as one would predict based on the name. Apparently this only occurs between September and January, and appears to be related to nutrition, possibly driven by pregnancy (the pups usually are born in April). The females seem to be ingesting something at the bottom of some of the pits, suggesting a nutritional component. Brisbin has looked and hasn’t found any evidence of the dogs eating insects or any other animals, so perhaps the dogs are finding minerals in certain deposits of sand. Just speculating… Anyone else have a dog who does the same? I have a video of an Aussie who makes “snow pits” with his snout. It’s outrageously funny to watch and probably related to scent, but otherwise inexplicable to the mind of apes like us, but I’ve never seen “snout pits”.
The second behavior that I find especially interesting is that all Carolina dogs bury their feces by covering them with sand. The behavior is highly ritualized; the dogs circle the pile of feces and and as they do, push sand on top of it with their noses. We’ve all seen plenty of dogs defecate and then scratch the soil, sometimes resulting in a partially buried pile, but this is very different, in that the dogs use their noses in a perfect circle and work hard to cover the pile completely. My Border Collie, Lassie used to bury food on occasion: she’d rip up grass, place it carefully on top of a piece of kibble, and then tamp it down with her nose. She’d repeat this until the object was completely covered. But that was food, not feces, and I can’t remember hearing about dogs who buried their poop using their noses until now. Brisbin says the only other dogs who cover their feces with sand or dirt pushed up by their noses are Afghans and Basenjis. And so I ask you: have you had or seen a dog who covered its feces by using its nose to push sand or dirt over it? If so, do you know the genetic background of the dog? I’d love to hear more about this. (This is another one of those “Anyone looking for a PhD topic” questions, just fyi.)
Needless to say, dogs like Carolina dogs, who appear to be ancient breeds, bring up a host of issues. I look forward to hearing from you about the questions posed…
MEANWHILE, back on the farm: You gotta love living in the country. Where else do you get to rescue a 900 lb cow off of the highway, and bring her back to the farm for an overnight under the apple tree? Meet Louise:
I met Louise on the county highway about a half a mile from my house, after someone stopped at the farm and asked if that was my cow on the road. “Nope, don’t have any cows,” I said, and went back to trying to wash the pig sh– off of Willie. (I do apologize, but the slimy feces of pigs, once smeared all over your dog, can only be described as pig sh–. Calling it poop or feces doesn’t begin to give it the power it deserves.) But I digress, that’s another story.
A second car stopped and said there is a cow right in the middle of the road, was it mine? Oh dear, no, but apparently it was standing right on top of a steep hill on a blind curve–a serious, if not fatal, accident waiting to happen. While the visitor (thank you Becky, wherever you are!) went to ask other neighbors if they’d lost a 900 lb animal, I drove up, parked and made friends with the cow, who turned out to be the lovely Brown Swiss you see in the photo. We began a delightful conversation and began to stroll together along the road toward my farm. (And I always thought my ability to moo like a cow was a useless skill. Oh ye of little faith.) Miss Swiss allowed me to walk beside her, so I flagged down cars to slow them down as she ripped great mouthfuls of grass at road’s edge. Miss Swiss had a leather collar and a bell, but I was quite sure that if I tried to restrain her she’d try to bolt. My ability to stop an animal that size by a collar being nil, I felt it wiser to finesse the issue and continue our mutual conversation. Several times she began to veer into the road, but I was able to herd her back and slow any approaching cars.
However, once we got to my farm Miss Swiss took one look at the grass in my front yard and bolted across the road. If you’ve never worked with cows, you might imagine that they are slow and lumber-y. Not so, they are as fast as the wind when they want to be, but luckily I saw it coming and was able to slow the approaching car. By then Becky had returned and another good country samaritan stopped his truck and the three of us herded her behind the barn and through a gate into my main pasture. While the sheep watched in a state of shock, Miss Swiss ambled up through the woods and parked herself under an apple tree at the top of the hill above the house. That’s where I took this photo, right before returning to the house to start trying to find her owner. Willie was left to sit happily in his crate stinking to high heaven.
Many phone calls later, I located the number of the only farmer any of us knew with Brown Swiss, who said, yes, he had a cow with a collar and a bell. His farm was a long way away, but cows can cover ground pretty fast, so it seemed a possibility. He was able to come over a few hours later and hiked up the hill with me to claim her. “Uh oh,” he said, “that’s not my cow,” Argh, seriously? I should be clear here that 1) Miss Swiss being in the pasture meant that neither the sheep nor Willie could be there either and 2) I was concerned she’d have enough to eat because the lack of rain has left the pasture bereft of grass and 3) I live in the kind of area where everyone knows everyone else and NO ONE could imagine where else this cow could have come from. Lots of Angus cows, yes. Lots of Herefords, and Holsteins, but Brown Swiss? “But wait!” said my new farmer friend as he was about to leave, “I’ll bet I know who owns her.”
And yes, he did. It turns out that Miss Swiss is actually named Louise, and had been brought a few days ago to a pasture not far from my farm, which didn’t turn out to have adequate fencing. Louise’s owner came to take her home the next morning, and we loaded her up out of the barn while my sheep and Willie watched on the other side of the fence with eyes like platters. I’m glad she’s home, and I’m glad that I have my pasture back, but… Truth be known, now I sort of miss her. She really is a lovely, lovely cow.
And oh yeah, two baths later, Willie still stinks.
Laura Anne Welch says
Although I don’t have direct experience with the Carolina Yellow Dog, last year a lady was at a local agility trial with one. She said that he is independent, but was easy to live with and she was glad that she had decided to get him.
As far as Willie’s residual stink, have you tried the skunk odor removal recipe? That is 1/4cup baking soda, 1/2 cup of peroxide dissolved in a quart of water. Apply to the dog, let sit for 5 minutes, and rinse well. It was the only thing that got rid of skunk odor after my dogs took a direct hit, but, whenever they got wet, they had a slight perfume o’ skunk for about 6 months, or until the new coat had grown in.
Alaska says
When you asked about living with New Guinea singing dogs and Basenjis, I immediately thought of the true story of Jake (Basenji) and Gus Pong (NGSD) called “Dogs in Elk”, which has been permanently memorialized on the internet by this illustrated recreation. It is well worth a visit, and quite relevant to the question at hand:
http://alumni.media.mit.edu/~solan/dogsinelk/
Alaska says
I should have mentioned that you will also want to read the link confirming the truth of the story, as it has further details about living with a New Guinea Singing Dog:
http://alumni.media.mit.edu/~solan/dogsinelk/validity.htm
Juniper says
I used to work at a dog daycare, and there was a couple who had two Carolina Dogs. The dogs were almost feral. Very scared of new people (though they were avoidant rather than aggressive), uncomfortable around other dogs. Super bonded to their owners. The couple loved these two individuals but were sick of having such timid dogs, said they would never get any more, and that no one else should either. Also they had gotten these two from a breeder and agreed that the breeder was nuts.
The basenjis that came through the daycare were similar, but not as extreme. They didn’t care for other dogs but tolerated being around them, and were aloof but more easily bonded with new people. That fits with what I’ve read about them online, along with stories about them being independent and sometimes difficult to motivate for training (unless you have a foodie individual).
Many of the Asian breeds seem to be this way – Shiba Inus are common in my area and are similar: dog-dog issues, aloof with people, independent and hard to motivate to work with you.
yifr says
Wow, such an adventure with Louise! I bet she is happy to be home.
Yes, Old Yeller is a yaller/yeller/yellow dog. It’s fascinating to me how lines of free-ranging dogs in the soutern US have sort of segregated themselves into distinct phenotypes, and how natural barriers like mountains, rivers, and swamps contribute to this segregation. Perhaps some element of sexual preference was in play that helped maintain the genetic homogeneity in this case? Maybe something to do with scent preference and location-specific mineral residues that they pick up while making their snout mounds? It is such an odd behavior that the Darwinist storyteller in me wants it to serve some function!
I’m very curious to hear about breed quirks of basenjis and other “less-domesticated” dogs. The ones I have met in the city never struck me as particularly friendly; not shy, just somewhat aloof, like some Northern breed dogs (I know that’s a huge generalization, with numerous exceptions I’m sure). Basenjis are such cute neotenous-looking little guys that it’s hard to think of them as semi feral.
Dena Norton (Izzee's Mom) says
Trisha,
In the video of the Aussie making snow pits, it looks to me like he is sticking his snout into the holes made by the snowshoer’s pole. It certainly has the appearance of being related to scent in some way.
Louise is certainly a lovely looking cow. I’m glad she enjoyed your conversation enough to follow you home to apples and safety.
HFR says
I once read that if you let all dogs free to breed indiscriminately you would eventually end up with one generic dog. That dog would be medium sized, sandy brown in color, short haired, curly tailed and prick eared. It’s interesting to me that so many of the “original” breeds look so like that: Basenji, NGSD, Carolina Dog. Of course, what I read years ago may have been disproved by now (it had something to do with a remote island that let their dogs wander free), but it’s interesting to think that what was the purest of the breeds could also be the most diverse.
Kat says
When Ranger anointed himself with a generous amount of decayed sea creature (really there wasn’t enough left to identify the original nature of the creature by the time he found it it was a rotten puddle of goo) and four baths did little to alleviate the aroma I used coffee grounds. I don’t remember where I read it now but somewhere it was suggested that rubbing coffee grounds through the fur was a good deodorizer and it worked for Ranger.
Finna is constantly burying things and uses her nose to ‘shovel’ dirt, leaves,dirty laundry, really whatever material is handy , over her treasure that she’s saving for later. I’ve never seen her bury her feces that way though.
I’m curious what a snout pit looks like. Finna likes to dig down a few inches and then begin burrowing forward in a nose sized excavation. We’re working on putting her digging on cue so she can help me in the garden. Currently about 50% of the time I can loosen a shovel full of soil and ask her if she wants to dig and she’ll happily dig sometimes quite impressive excavations other times a shallow pit and nose burrow that reaches back a foot or so. The other day she excavated most of a dead sapling I wanted to remove.
001mum says
I’d miss Louise too. What a sweetie.
and now I finally know what Carolina dog is! 🙂
Lynn U. says
That’s funny. I just met an “American Dingo” puppy yesterday. Cute, but extremely wary of strangers. The guy said, “The pet store said that he would be like that.” I bit my tongue and saved my reaction to the idea of getting any dog from a pet store, let alone a primitive breed that is not likely to be inclined to be social, for the friend I was with, rather than the guy with the dog. Wouldn’t have helped. But since you all will understand, IN WHAT UNIVERSE IS IT A GOOD IDEA TO BUY A SEMI-FERAL DOG FROM A PET STORE? At least the puppy wasn’t fear aggressive, just didn’t want to get anywhere near any strangers, even if they were looking away and holding chicken jerky.
Oh, and if you haven’t read the story of Jake, Gus Pong and the elk that Alaska posted, you must do it post haste. I’ve probably read it half a dozen times over the past few years, and it makes me cry with laughter every time.
Margaret McLaughlin says
In my (thankfully now past) days as a groomer Dawn dishwashing detergent was my weapon of choice for dogs who reeked. It usually works. Just rinse until you think Willie’s going down the drain too, or he’ll be itching.
No personal experience with the primitive breeds, so I am looking forward to comments.
My 5th grade teacher read Old Yeller to the class. I cried for days, & have never dared reread it.
Rose C says
Trisha, it seems to me like you have a knack for talking animals out to get off expressways and highways. 🙂
Heather Staas says
I’ve got 4″ of sand in my daycare yard, and one dog that does go around and try to bury feces with sand on the occasions that he finds it before we do. Not just his own, but others to. He’s a black and white pointer-ish mix about 45lbs.
Both my german shepherds make a small muzzle depression/hole in the yard and eat/chew something out of it with their front teeth. It’s a fairly deep hole, several inches, and narrow. I’d always assumed it was something squirrels or other rodents had buried and fermented. I’ve never actually “seen” what’s there, but they do scrape at the dirt in the bottom of the hole as well.
PD says
Anyone with experience with a Cireneco dell Etna? I know one and her person describes similar wariness of strangers and she was very difficult to house train–just generally much less interested in pleasing her people than the other dogs in the house. She theorizes that the island origins of the dog made it “semi feral,” and after reading this, it makes sense.
Jennifer Hamilton says
While pig poop is horrible, my dog has Willy beat!
We were having some major landscaping work done in our yard. I brought my dog home one day and she went running into the bushes. After noticing she hadn’t come back out shortly thereafter, I called her to me. When she didn’t come, I thought she must have found some food wrappers that the workers probably tossed in the bushes. When repeated calls didn’t work, I went into the bushes to pull her out…assuming I may have to pull hamburger wrappers out of her mouth. Instead, I found a dog rolling gleefully in the most disgusting pile of human poop imaginable. How did I know it was human poop? Because it see like no animal poop I’ve ever smelled. It was so disgusting, I couldn’t stop wretching. And my dog was happy as a pig in mud. She had smashed it into her face, her eyes, her ears, her snout, her neck, her collar, her shoulders. She acted as if she won the scent lottery! I don’t understand it because she has never rolled in dog poop, ever. Why was human poop so damn exciting? And now…how do I clean off caked on, smeared in human poop, that makes me want to gag, from every crevice of my dog’s face? It was the most disgusting experience I have ever had. And you can bet, all the workers got a lecture the next day about shitting in the bushes!
Vicki in Michigan says
Nature’s Miracle Skunk-Off really is like a miracle, on skunk spray. I don’t know if it works on pig s***, and it may not work after other sorts of cleaners have been used, but it’s what I would try, if my dog was stinky from getting into something natural.
One time when I was a young dog-owner, I ran out of kibble and gave my Pembroke corgi her dinner in milkbones. Apparently that was more milkbones than she wanted to eat all at once. She carried them into the living room, put them in secure places (like behind furniture legs), and did her best to cover them with air, pushing it over them with her nose. She would work, and work, and discover they were still completely visible. Then she’d cry, and move them, and start over. That’s my only experience with a dog trying to cover something by pushing something with its nose. If she’d been outside where there was dirt, I’m sure she would have been pushing dirt. (Eventually I picked them up so she could stop worrying about hiding them well.)
One final thought — if only people would spend a teeny tiny bit of time thinking about whether anything they do is “a good idea”, the world would be a vastly better place. Buying a semi-feral dog from anywhere, let alone a pet store, is, I am willing to bet, almost always a really bad idea…………….
Debby says
If found the Carolina dogs “Snout pit “formation fascinating.
I don’t really know if this is a”zoobiquitous” behavior or not but thre is a human behavior called “pica” in which the person craves and consumes large amounts of non food substaces. Ice is the most common followed by dirt, clay and laundy starch. It is more common in pregnant women. One of the first tests usually done if a woman tells her medical provider about this is a Complete Blood Count to look for anemia. If the patient isn’t anemic then the provider may look for vitamin and mineral deficiencies.
I would love to read more of the research about Carolina dogs and snout pits.
em says
Wowee! This post is just fascination-packed! I know next to nothing about Carolina dogs and would be thrilled to hear more. I’ve never observed the snout pit (though my old female dog did dig shallow pits under the lilac bush to lie in in the summer months. She used her feet and didn’t eat anything as far as I know- she was just trying to create a cool spot, so completely different than the behavior that you describe) nor have I ever had a dog who deliberately buried poop.
I HAVE had some unpleasant experiences with dogs and sh*t (fox, cow, mystery foulness) as well as dead things, though. It’s drying for their skin and so I try not to overuse this trick, but I often find stubborn stinks respond pretty well to dishwashing liquid (the kind for the sink, not the machine). Dawn is my go-to, but I’ve had pretty good success with other brands. It’s the grease-cutting feature, that works, I think- it strips stink residue that’s permeated the dogs’ skin oils off the coat. Unfortunately it works by stripping the oil off the coat, period, and you have to be very careful not to get it in the eyes and nose, etc., so stink directly on the head and face is a bit harder to cope with. Still, desperate times find me sudsing them up and then just smearing them down with conditioner once I’m satisfied that the bath took.
What an exciting adventure with Miss Louise, and how lucky that she was such a tame and agreeable cow. My experience with cows is limited to the exposure that everyone gets living in a dairy-intensive region, but I know enough to realize that even among dairy breeds, a cow co-operative and friendly enough to follow a stranger up the road is a special girl. I’m also very partial to Brown Swiss (and Jerseys even more so, but don’t tell Miss Louise that). I know that cows take a lot more work and a lot more space to keep than sheep, but still, Louise looks awfully pretty and awfully happy under your apple tree. 🙂 I can understand why you’d miss her.
Liza says
I’ve had basenjis for about 20 years. My first dogs were from British and American lines, then I got a 1/4 African bitch. She’s 14 now, retired pretty much from everything but nosework, and has about 40 titles in obedience, rally, coursing, and agility. She’s totally foody, which is what made everything possible. She’s unbelievably predatory, and has killed field mice while I’ve been walking her on a 4-foot leash. Just dives into the grass or leaves, grabs, shakes, and tosses aside. She’s really taught me a lot about positive training.
When her breeder died, I acquired her father. He’s totally different. He’s 1/2 African, and a total sweetie to me, and to his couple of friends, but he really, REALLY doesn’t want to meet new people. He’s curious about them, and wants a quick sniff, but he doesn’t like being petted or even looked at. We taught him how to back away after his quick sniff, and he does quite well. At almost 15, he’s mellowed out a lot.
The current prospect, now 3, is also 1/4 African, but totally different. He’s much more interested in pleasing me and playing with me and getting his belly rubbed, and less interested in food. He’s also proving a training challenge!
There are exceptions, but generally basenjis are aloof with strangers, not real interested in checking every new person out, quite content with a small circle of friends. Pressure doesn’t work on them like on other dogs–it’s always interesting to see someone who handles mostly herding breeds try to pressure the basenjis into following a line in agility, for example. Pulling or sending almost always works better than pushing.
em says
Oh! Vicki in Michigan’s comment reminded me of this!
On the subject of covering things with snouts (but not feces), Otis has a really weird quirk. His kitchen bed is next to our pantry cupboard, which for obvious reasons, I almost always keep closed. Occasionally, however, he’ll come into the room when I’m baking and see the cupboard door open. He makes a beeline for it, sniffs around it carefully but doesn’t attempt to touch anything inside, then begins to very deliberately run his snout over the surface of his bed (beside the cupboard) toward the open door of the cupboard as though he were trying to push some invisible substance inside. He’s done this every time he sees the door open- for years now. I generally don’t encourage it, because I’m afraid he’ll get friction burns on his poor nose, but he doesn’t ever touch anything in the pantry or make digging motions with his feet, so it’s never made any sense to me.
He mostly uses this snout motion to “nest” by rucking up blankets and pillows into comfortable shapes (he’s really good at this, he’ll make himself perfect bolsters to curl into), so that’s the very puzzling context in which I initially saw this behavior near the cupboard, but I suppose it is entirely possible and indeed much more likely that he’s reacting to an impulse to “bury” our unaccountably exposed cache of foodstuffs. I can’t believe it never occurred to me before.
vicki says
I found that prairie hay in the dog house worked wonders for residual stink on a dog. We had a dog who was an expert skunk dispatcher – his record was 3 in 5 days – so we had our fair share of experience. After a bath in the peroxide/baking soda mixture we found sleeping in prairie hay for a couple of nights made the lingering odor all but disappear.
Dr.A.Chandrasekaran says
I concur with what HFR said. Almost all street dogs in India and South East Asia used to be what the Carolina Dogs or Dingoes look like. Of course with many a pedigree dogs being abandoned for one reason or other and left to fend for themselves , slowly the street dogs have become a motley mixture of many northern breeds and have lost their original feral look, lost their hardyness and behaviour.
Anne says
My male, parti colored standard poodle buries his feces by pushing mulch over it using his nose. He only does this if we do not clean it up quickly enough for his liking and no longer buries other dog’s feces as he used to when a puppy. I also have his aunt and friend’s have two of his brothers and none of these three dogs exhibit this behavior. Thanks for another interesting post.
August says
I have a 6 year old Shepard/Husky/Coyote mix (or maybe she’s all Carolina Dog). Pogo (because she pogo’s over fences and pogo’s up and catches and eats birds) was adopted from the Human Society here in New Mexico at a 1 year and 3 months old. She originally came from a Indian reservation and she has well…. issues. She looks almost like the photo, add on a dark muzzle and ears.
Fearful of people, fearful of anything new, very apprehensive on meeting new people, extremely anxious (takes Prozac daily), very bonded to me and her furry brother Lenny (Airedale and Border Collie X), VERY routine driven, my back yard is vermin free, she’s an escape artist and she digs snout holes every year from last winter to mid spring. They are are exactly the shape of her muzzle. I’ve see her lick the bottom of the pit. If I rebury the pit she reopens it. Once May comes she stops and and I able to rebury the holes. She does dig in the same spots in the yard each year.
She does not cover her poops.
My Vet is convinced that she have Coyote in her…
Frances says
Sophy has been digging this year – feet and snout, and making innumerable small holes in the lawns. Wherever she digs the other dogs follow, and they are finding something to eat, but whether it is roots, worms, or insects I do not know. I’ve often seen dogs use nose shoves to cover things, particularly toys, but never faeces – Pippin-cat, on the other hand, follows the dogs around and long sufferingly tries to cover every trace of urine and faeces he finds…I am still trying to get my mind around the mental processes behind that!
liz says
I have a dog who has buried feces with sand- but only on islands and on a few (couple?) rare occasions. His mix is unknown, but most guesses include northern or East Asian breeds. He’s very particular about where his pooping routine in general. But a couple of times during camping trips he went the extra step to push sand in the depression he chose as his “cat hole” with his nose. It reminded me of what humans do to leave no trace. I remember wondering if he was hiding it from ‘predators,’ but now, considering that the Carolina dogs are also in isolated areas, I wonder if there is possibly an element of sanitation involved…
Emily says
Oh, I loved Old Yeller as a kid, I read it over and over, how many buckets I wept over that one (Charlotte’s Web was the other) 🙂 After working in a shelter for over 10 years now, I reckon Old Yeller could have been any of the larger Southern cur dogs or cross thereof–he had (in the book) that combination of herding, hound and catch-dog traits that shows up in the Southern all-purpose ranch types.
I wish we could do a lot more DNA testing for regional quirks and just plain curiosity; the look of the Carolina dog isn’t uncommon in our rural Northern California county, and most folks call them “dingos.” But the local Kelpie and cattle dog mixes will throw a very similar look and so will the Reservation dogs, so without DNA testing, breed ID is pretty futile. I suspect that some of our Reservation populations are so far removed from anything “Fancy” that the average available DNA test–like Wisdom Panel–would have its brain fried, either with No Identifiable Breeds or a bizarre assortment of highly unlikelies like Glen of Imaal Terrier and Scottish Deerhound.
For burying stuff, my Catahoula mix is a Fixed Action Pattern queen–give her a marrow bone or a toy she finds especially high value and you can watch her eyes glaze over as some other part of her brain seems to engage. Boney must be buried–and the pattern is always the same: she searches for the right spot, digs a hole using both paws, wedges the treasure in carefully, and always covers it using her nose. It’s like the behavior runs on rails, with minimal variation. So I’d wonder–is that kind of burying a genuine FAP in dogs, and if so, maybe Carolina dogs either regard their poo as high value (to be returned to later if necessary?) or the Carolina dogs that had that burying FAP triggered by feces got some kind of evolutionary benefit–more safety from predators, less harassment from domestic dogs, something–so the trait increased frequency in their closed gene pool? Oh dear, that sparks the question–do we have a catalog of wolf FAPs, how many are retained by dogs, how they show up or not in different breeds, how those traits drift if not maintained… golly, golly, what a study that could be if there isn’t one already.
Love genetics, love old Yeller, love your blog, Trisha–love that there are so many exciting things still to learn about our dogs!
Bethany says
Nope, no dogs burying feces here with their noses. But, I do have a dog that humps any couch/pillow/toy that she can find. 😉
I would love to hear of any research they do with these dogs. It sounds very interesting and I wonder what health issues this new breed is prone to.
Heather says
We had a border collie (possibly with some husky in there somewhere, given how she loved to talk and sing) who would bury her feces if there was soil or mulch available in the yard, using her nose to push the soil/mulch neatly over the feces. We adopted her when she was 2 so don’t know if her parents or siblings also had this behaviour; she’d been surrendered to a BC rescue group by a local cattle ranch due to her failure as a herding dog — she loved to chase the cows but not herd them, perhaps more evidence of husky or something else in her background in addition to border collie?
Robin Jackson says
The South Carolina Department of Natural Resources did a television interview with Professor Brisbin about Carolina dogs. Doesn’t add anything informationally to what Trisha has already written, but it’s interesting to hear him talk about them and of course lots of video of the dogs at various ages. They also note that if socialised early these dogs do like to hang out with people, but don’t usually like to be petted.
Lisa Marshall says
Hi, I’ve had basenjis for over 20 years. Our first basenji Katie would bury bones in the backyard (and immediately go back and dig them up, move them, repeat) and also used her nose to make depressions in the bed quilts to bury her bones in the house. She is the only basenji I’ve had that did that. Never buried poop though. As a new owner to basenjis back in the late 1980s, it seemed the advice I remember most was never let them loose (still good advice) and I was often told “they are not trainable so don’t even try”. Years later in addition to conformation showing and lure coursing, I have added titles in Agility and Rally. Our latest endeavor is K9 Nosework. My 9 year old bitch Miranda just passed her birch oil Odor Recognition Test in August and we hope to enter a Level 1 trial next year. They are most definitely trainable with reward based training methods and short training sessions that end while they are still eager to work. Basenjis are very intelligent and clever and entertaining. Mine are all happy with a very small select group of human and canine friends beyond which they are not at all interested.
Shana R says
I love this topic! I’ve commented before about my Tibetan Mastiffs, in the post about the two dogs vying for the kibble.
Tibetan Mastiffs are very primitive dogs, and I think it will be interesting to see how, if at all, they change over the decades of breeding in the west. Out of necessity we do select for a temperament that makes them safe in our western world. Their Chinese counterparts, from what I have heard from breeders who have visited, are highly aggressive and generally unwilling to be handled by strangers. In the west we try to moderate that because we simply must – our dogs must be safe lest they be put down by the authorities.
In terms of primitive traits, for one, they cycle only once a year, usually in the Fall or early Winter. Occasionally you get an outlier who is late Winter or early Spring, or even the Summer, but its very very uncommon. Those in the southern hemisphere also cycle during their winter. This is great for breeders, and a curse of course, because we only have to deal with breeding season once a year (and half the breeding opportunities), and females living together (much like humans) tend to cycle together. I know all dogs can be destructive in an effort to get to females in season, but TMs tend to be especially obnoxious about it. Eating through houses, howling constantly, refusing to eat for weeks. All the normal things you might associate with a male dog in proximity to in season females is just worse.
My male will mark with poop, one leg up, trying to get his poop up high. He doesn’t do this in his own yard, but on walks. My female does not, and my male’s breeder said some will do so but its not overly common, so this is probably not representative of the entire population.
They like to dig caves. My TMs, as house dogs who get to play outside, don’t usually dig big enough holes to be caves, but they will universally dig and if given enough time, will dig caves. If not, they will at least dig pits large enough to lay in. Females tend to use their faces in the digging process, lots of snout excavation. But not the snout pits you speak of.
Temperamentally, they are aloof, barely tolerant of strangers in their territory. They usually aren’t offensively aggressive with strangers, specifically those who are not supposed to be there. This is true in the west and in Tibet – their Chinese counterparts may be different as the Chinese have been selecting for aggression. I’ve heard and read stories from the people who first “discovered” the dogs in Tibet in the 70’s, where they were guarding flocks and would charge down the mountainside towards passers-by, then stop 20 feet away and bark until the people passed on. I’ve seen this in my own yard when I unsuspectingly let my male out to potty, only to discover a worker was in the side yard (we were having tile floors installed, he was getting water from the hose – my bad!) They will generally “hold the line” if an intruder is found, not outright attack the person. This may involve a 10 ft distance between the stranger and the dog, or they might get right up in their face. They will hold the person there until their human arrives. This is the only time I think these dogs defer to their people.
They are extremely independent, and therefore hard to train. Food is sometimes a motivator, sometimes play is. But you usually have to work to keep them motivated. They can do agility and rally, I’ve worked on both with mixed results, but I’m hopeful I can squeeze a title out of my male. My female is another story entirely, she’s an adorable lost cause which I will continue my fruitless efforts to train.
With an intensive, yet slow and patient, socialization process, you can get these guys past the aloof, standoffish behavior in public. There is a great deal of variety in how they react to situations. My male is very aloof at home, but more friendly in public (he thinks dog shows are a big party) while my female is quick to accept people at home and is silly and playful, but outside the house she is all business, thinks shows are a terrible thing she must endure and is generally a serious, reserved dog. My male is not physically affectionate beyond the initial “you’re home!” greetings, choosing to cuddle from 3-infinite feet away. My female is the lay on your feet, sleep on your pillow in bed kind.
In short, a TM is a primitive dog – they cycle once every 12 months, they are aloof, independent and not biddable in any sense of the word. They are smart, territorial and act much like a tame wolf. I’m sure you’ve seen the videos showing how wolves won’t default look to people (even when raised by people) to solve problems like domesticated dogs do. I don’t think I’ve seen my two look to me ever to help get something they want, I usually step in to keep them from destroying something in their quest for the toy or whatever that’s out of reach. They are intense, sharp dogs, not for the faint of heart. They will fight over resources, and they need owners who are strong and will hold the line. They don’t need a dictator for an owner, but they will constantly test boundries, so you must stay firm about what is ok and what is not ok. They believe they know what is best, and if they don’t want to listen, they won’t. But, when you look in their eyes, you can see an ancient wisdom there that you just don’t see in other domestic breeds, so perhaps they do know better. There is a little bit of the wild still there.
Robin Jackson says
One additional informational point Professor Brisbin mentions in the interview that I didn’t pick up at first: Carolina dogs typically come into season only once a year, not twice like most medium size AKC breeds. The Basenji Club says many Basenjis also come into season only once a year.
https://www.basenji.org/ClubDocs/AKCBasenjiFlier.pdf
Kat says
I showed the photo to my husband and his first comment was how much it looks like Finna. She has GSD markings and a stub tail but he’s right the legs, body build, ears and face do look like her. Her paperwork says she’s GSD/Corgi and I have no reason to doubt it. It just struck me as interesting that her looks could be so similar in terms of shape.
JM says
trying again after I sent the last reply into outer space.
I had a shepherd-ish mixed breed dog who used to bury his feces when he was younger sometimes. He was born on a farm in Vermont and they had his parents and grandparents so I suspect he was NOT part Carolina dog. He more commonly did it in sand or snow. I suspect gravel or clay is just harder to work with a snout. He was born in the month of November to a mostly outdoor dog. So he spent the formative weeks on hay and snow and I wonder if that had any effect. I wonder how much of the behavior is genetic, physical environment such as the type of whelping area/den, or available surfaces or ability to be able to move away from a whelping area easily, or perhaps it’s learned from a mother who has the behavior. Also wonder the reason, cleanliness or other
Cindy M says
I have an 11 year old Ridgeback that has an unusual burying behavior. I have an old Ford Ranger with a shell over the bed that serves as my Dog Wagon. Whenever I fill up at the gas station, Taz will attempt to bury the inside corner of the truck bed where the gas intake dumps into the gas tank below. Using his nose, he will circle the area, and if there are blankets in that part of the truck bed, they will be included, and push the blankets or air in an attempt to cover up that part of the truck bed. I don’t know if it’s the sound of the liquid gurgling into the gas tank or the odor, or something else, but he’s clearly trying to cover something up. He’s done it for as long as I can remember. None of my other Ridgebacks have ever done this, and this is the only situation Taz expresses this particular behavior. I’m stumped.
Trisha says
First off, I’m happy to say that Willie smells like dog again, rather than Eau de Porcine. Once I finally had Louise settled I used a commercial “de-skunker” liquid I’ve used for fox poop, and it worked just fine. Thanks though for all the suggestions.
I’m loving hearing about your experiences with some of the more ‘ancient’ breeds (Shana R, thank you so much for adding Tibetan Mastiffs to the mix! Fascinating!) It is true that one of the unique features of Basenji’s is that they don’t always cycle twice a year, as do domestic dogs. “Less domesticated” canids tend to cycle only once a year, more like wolves, foxes and coyotes, and so I have always thought that was a good potential marker of the genetics of a breed. “Independent” is the term I most often hear, and it fits with my experience with breeds like Basenji’s and Afghans. It makes sense that one would see that in dogs in North American from the reservation too, given that they had to be independent to survive. Kat, I loved hearing that your husband said your Finna looked just like a Carolina dog. I’m curious about her paperwork: are you confident of those breeds as being parents, or was that someone’s guess?
It sounds like a few of you have had dogs who buried feces with sand or dirt, using their muzzles. Interesting that one is a Standard Poodle!
Gotta run to go give a speech in Waukesha for the Humane Animal Welfare Socity, but more tomorrow. (And JM, I feel your pain. I wrote a bunch of comments yesterday that I can’t find, they apparently have joined your last reply in cyberspace. It must be crowded there.)
Mihaela Onciu says
Hi, Trisha!
I haven’t been by your website in quite a while (new job, new baby, treating husband and then dog for cancer – both are doing OK now, etc). I came back today to see that it got bigger and better than ever and that so much has happened. Belated congratulations on getting married!!!!
I wanted to ask you a question, unrelated to today’s blog: sometime in another life(!!) I attended one of your seminars, I think it was in Madison, and somewhere in that seminar I think it was said that a dog gives on average 17 warning signs before proceeding to biting. Do you recall that? and if so, do you recall the source of that information? I thought it was maybe a study, but can’t recall any details. I told our vet oncologist about that this morning and she asked if I could find the source. She is preparing a talk about pain control/accupuncture for a national meeting.
Thank you so much for any answer you can give me! I know how busy you must be.
Mihaela
Ruth says
Our basenji is probably more people friendly than most. Cooper even worked by my side as a demo dog when I was a trainer in a pet supply store. His finest moments included calming a four year old who was beside herself at not being able to pet the fish and befriending an anxious dog to allow me to fit a collar for its owner. One of his few true baroos was upon meeting an Italian Greyhound in the toy aisle.
He dislikes being petted on the head by strangers and must be kept away from the door when guests arrive at our current house but makes friends fast and loves to cuddle. We had to get him a covered bed so he could be covered all night, as he has a human dander allergy.
Cooper is so smart that I really have to be careful when training and social situations. He will manage to learn a completely different behavior if I’m not watchful. Since his forced retirement (we moved), he has reverted fast to leash reactivity after being ambushed by off leash dogs on several occasions. It only takes one situation like this, even if it’s not serious, for him to develop new behavior.
Ally says
I have had the opportunity to work with a Carolina Dog from puppy hood till adult hood via private and group training sessions. He was very skittish as a pup (even of his new family) and it took a while for him to be okay in new places and around people. He took to dogs easily and was the star of many classes as he learned quickly. He still is wary of strangers, but doesn’t depict it outwardly (doesn’t hide, run). His owners are excellent with him and really have people respect his space.
KT says
my dogs dig up dirt with their noses and eat it. There are little divots in the soft dirt by my gate. The dogs like to eat dirt that is mostly free from grass and other plants. I can tell they eat it by looking at their fecal matter, even if I didn’t watch
BL says
I’m pretty sure my dog is a Carolina Dog, or at least a mix of one – she looks almost exactly like them and your picture, though she has a very short, slick coat.
I have seen her cover her feces with sand, but not every time and only when I lived somewhere with sandy soil. She doesn’t do it at the beach. Although I have to say I scoop it up so quickly I don’t give her the chance.
Same with snout pits – she has done it, but not all the time. Often she comes up with a tasty grub.
My dog is insanely smart, and her prey drive is through the roof – which is the only negative. Can’t have her near a cat…ever. She’s good with other dogs but can sometimes be the rude staring dog and doesn’t like them in her face. I have her in K9 Nosework classes and she excels.
When I first adopted her (she was 1.3 years old) I strongly felt she was part basenji, but that was before i’d heard of Carolina dogs. I live in North Carolina and see Carolina dogs all the time – fun to think that maybe they are the descendants of that first group.
Thanks for writing about them!
lynne says
My jack russels both make snout holes. They are definitely eating mud from the bottom of the hole, my elder dog loves to come and try and give you muddy kisses after. A clay pan runs about 3/4inches under the soil and this is what they appear to be after, they spit out the grass and topsoil. Both have recently had blood tests for separate issues and they are in good health with no obvious deficiencies. They both spend some considerable time choosing the right spot and will sometimes start a hole then change their minds and pick a different spot.
Mary Starling says
My young Finnish Lapphund bitch of 2 yrs displays this covering of scats every day. I bred her from Finnish x Danish parents and can trace the lines back 10+ generations, except for one dog that was more recently brought into the gene pool from Sami farmers in the 1990’s.
Interestingly my bitch only covers her scats in this way in my garden, even if I am watching her. She does not attempt to do so elsewhere eg farmland, beach, marshland or forest.
At home I actually tell her its OK, and I will pick it up. Upon which she ceases to cover it, looks at me and walks away. Bizarre but interesting.
Amongst its followers the FL is considered primitive by many, some have annual oestrus for example.
Gin says
If your dog has only rolled in human shit one time, you are incredibly lucky. That’s all I have to say.
Miranda says
I have a Carolina Dog! Bea is very independent, but not timid. She will her best to dig snout pits in the fall, and if we are in an area with sandy/loose soil she will cover her poop.
Bea has an incredible prey drive and will sit motionless for (what seems like) hours scanning the landscape. And her ears! They’re like radar and constantly twisting this way and that. Unfortunately, she had her tail docked (“happy tail”) previous to coming to me, so she lacks the long hook-like tail. (I also suspect this is a reason for her having trouble communicating to my border collie and resulting in some, uh, tussles at first.)
If you’re interested, here is my Flickr account with a ridiculous amount of photos of her: http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=beatrix&m=tags&w=as_imagined&ct=6&mt=all&adv=1&s=rec
Jeannette says
We have a dog at our facility that covers his feces using his nose, completely as soon as he goes. He is a pure bred GSD. (Our center uses pea gravel, so it is pretty easy to nose it around.)
Debbie says
One of my dogs covered her feces with her nose. She would also cover our other dogs feces, in the same manner. She did not develop this habit until later in life, and I can’t be sure that she didn’t learn it from our cat. Samantha was adopted from the Humane Society, and my best guess is that she was probably an Australian Shep/Border Collie mix. Phenomenal dog. She passed in January and will forever be missed.
Cindy says
My Shiba tries to bury her poop with her nose and I think my Jindo did, too. I think a lot of Shiba do this. I’ll take an informal survey in one of my Shiba groups. I never thought anything of it so I think it’s common among Shiba.
Stephanie says
My mongrel, Kama, looks a lot like “ancient breeds” (Carolina dog, Indian pariah dog,etc.) though he has folded ears. He is a mutt from Guam, which has a huge stray/feral population of dogs. The ferals there look like all the ancient breeds. Kama doesn’t cover his poo, but does snout pits. He is definitely finding some mineral or nutrient in the dirt. He is usually the one to start such behavior in the dog park, and then the other dogs join in, typically the same pit. He was stray.feral when I picked him off the street around 5months old. He is quite gregarious for a street dog.
Bits Foerg says
One of the dogs who boards here does a perfect circle, burying his feces with his nose. We live on almost pure sand, and he is most likely to poop on a nice, clear patch of sand. If he is in a hurry, or it is raining, though, he’ll just dump in the grass and run! Far from a Native Dog, though – he is a Doxie/Yorkie cross!
Yvette van veldhuijsen says
My 3 years old dingo male does the same thing with his snout. I think its a scent thing.. maybe insects under the ground, rodents? Scent from humans that walk there before us??
In the summer he did the same thing and suddely catch a snake.
He also want to sniff the breath of almost every visitor. I think just to know how healty the person is?
Rolly says
Dunno about these American dingoes, but, having lived in Australia and having shared living quarters with a number of Kelpies over the years, I’ve found it interesting that recent genetic research seems to point to there being some Dingo DNA in Kelpies, and, hence, in Cattle Dogs, which include some Kelpie in their breeding. The word on Dingoes in Australia was always that they could be adopted as pups by Aboriginals, but would only stay around till they reached the beginnings of adulthood, then drifted off.
Info and specifics on the genetic testing of Kelpies came from an Aussie documentary ordered from:
http://kelpiethelegend.com.au
Rachel says
I have a Canaan Dog, which is another pariah breed like the Carolina Dog, although from a much different part of the world. I also have a Rhodesian Ridgeback, and I’m endlessly fascinated by the differences in behavior and temperament between the two dogs. Jackson, the Ridgeback, has almost a complete lack of fear of novel stimuli. One of the commenters on the Dogs 101 episode of Ridgebacks made a comment to the effect that they are a breed that will stare danger in the face and then move forward, and I find that very much to be true.
Clover, my Canaan, is a completely different story. She is neophobic in the extreme, and regards even small things like moved furniture with deep suspicion. We went through a phase where she stopped eating from stainless steel bowls because I accidentally knocked one off a counter; fortunately feeding her dinner from a stainless steel bowl was almost self-desensitizing. 😉
The Ridgeback is quiet; Clover barks first and asks questions later. She’s also a ferocious small game hunter, with four confirmed kills just this summer alone, including one robin on the wing that she neatly snatched out of the air, and one groundhog that probably weighed a third of what she does. The Ridgeback wants nothing so much as to be where his people are; Clover loves her people, and is affiliative, but is also perfectly happy to hang out in the backyard without us.
Unfortunately for me, she didn’t get the once-a-year seasonal cycling trait; instead she’s been every five months, like clockwork.
Shawndra says
Funny you should post this as I just learned the my younger dog will neatly bury here feces if there is appropriate ground to do so. I never would have believed it if I hadn’t seen it. Most of our ground is too hard for it, but given a carpet of fallen fir needles she covered everything right up. So weird!
She’s a German shepherd/husky mix, primarily German shepherd… looks like a sable long stock coat with a husky tail tacked on. Very little interest in interacting with strangers and will dodge away if pursued by an aggressive greeter human. For the most part she acts German shepherd and has beautiful tracking genetics, nice deep nose in IPO tracks. She was born into rescue after the hoarding bust in MT in 2008, where some crazy dude was “breeding” distance mushing dogs. From what I can tell she is pretty normal compared to some of her relatives and many relatives of hers are that yellow/buff color. Some of her relatives are so feral they apparently just come and go as they please as per their owners fb posts. Supposedly there were some Belgian varities in that bust too, but IMO the pics I’ve seen all look like generic german shepherd/husky mixes. Who knows! From what research I’ve done, properly bred distance mushing dogs (as opposed to the sprint race dogs that are Northern breed/pointer mixes) usually consist of Northern breed (usually Sibe), shepherd or BC of some type, and often a little sight hound such as saluki…. so interesting that research has shown some sight hounds do the burying thing.
However she isn’t as good a hunter as my other dog who is a Siberian husky/German shepherd mix. They both hunt a lot, but boy my older girl is fast. She also has the full range of primitative talking chirps, woos, etc. and does the crazy husky zoomie/digging/rooting her nose thing. She doesn’t have the weird social issues my hoarding bust special does either, the older girl is very social and happy to go anywhere and do anything. She even moved a neighbor cow off my parent’s ranch last weekend.
Also there was a research project done by someone looking at genetics in sled dogs that was very interesting. The title is “Breed-specific ancestry studies and genome-wide association analysis highlight an association between the MYH9 gene and heat tolerance in Alaskan sprint racing sled dogs” and the PDF full text is published online. I found it especially interesting regarding the traits of my older dog whom I would consider a well bred distance sled dog. Freaky dog loves to sunbathe in 100 degree high desert summer and has endless endurance while the younger dog would rather hang out in the shade.
Had the pleasure of growing up with a survivalist BC (cattle ranch bred). We lived in the woods and boy was he a hunter! He’d dig through 4ft of snow to get mice and I once saw him jump 10ft straight up and snatch a bird midflight. He also went bear hunting with my dad. He was one of a kind and its neat seeing other commenters mentioning BC mixes on this topic!
Sasha says
I foster Korean Jindos and have watched my current foster use his nose to bury feces. He doesn’t do this on grass, but he performed the act on mulch. I’ve also read comments from other Jindo rescuers about a female that made “sun circles” after peeing. She appeared to be trying to cover up her urine, but in a strange circular motion. My previous foster went so far as to quickly bury cat urine in the litterpan as soon as the cat was done. I sense it was purely related to cleanliness. They are an ancient Asian breed that I find quite fascinating. I also own a Shiba Inu, that is the cleanest dog I’ve ever met. After the first 3 weeks he never had an accident in the house, and he gets very upset if his fur gets anything “gross” on it. He also tries to keep his paws very clean. A bonus for me!
Marj Kibby says
Yes, Australian Dingoes can be black and tan, though the ‘yellow’ is much more common.
I have a children’s story book based on a Native American legend that shows God and his dog walking the earth creating the landscape and animals. I always wondered why a Dingo was pictured, but it must be a Carolina Dog.
Marj Kibby says
My Cattle Dog with a friend’s pet Dingo who were great friends (both now deceased).
http://www.flickr.com/photos/marj_k/74213641/
Suzanne Morrone says
I had a feral dog from the Hopi Indian Reservation… got him about 25 or so years ago. At that time the reservation was very isolated and there were no fences. I always thought of him as “what dogs become when no one interferes with their breeding” thinking maybe some coyote etc. could be in his mix. But I saw a stuffed Dingo at a Natural Science Museum and he was an exact match. Unsettling seeing a twin of my dog dead and stuffed. Anyway, he had a lot of similar traits – very intense! very loyal, pretty dog aggressive regardless of the socialization from day one he got. He didn’t bury his feces, but he would only poop in the middle of bushes (if he had a choice) always! He was the best dog ever. We finally got a second dog, 1/2 wolf, and she understood him and they had the most perfect friendship ever. Absolutely partners in all things. And the only dog my Hopidog would be friendly with.
He also didn’t make snout pits, but I now have a female dog of who knows what breed, but could be a Shiba Inu mix though larger and she has always done this, and eats something in the dirt. She has favorite spots she returns to.
Nicole says
My australian cattle dog will get into digging “fits”. She will sniff the ground with her nose pressed to it and then start digging furiously. When she gets a little ways into the hole (which is usually pretty shallow) she will bit the dirt. I don’t think she eats it but she definitely bites the bottom of the pit. She gets a kind of zoned out look when she’s doing it.
eva says
I had a wolf(3/4) x malamute/husky that always buried her feces exactly as described — using her nose in a circle to move dirt or sand over it –
She met people and walked in for a quick sniff, and the retreated- never acting afraid- but with no interest in being petted by strangers.
She normally ate a home prepared meal — of mostly meat, with some veg and fruits and the occassional pizza crust.
But one time, i gave her tinned dog food — ( not cheapo brand- but a super-premium) however — she sniffed it several times, and then dumped the dish out and proceeded to bury it with her nose, I took that as a statement of opinion and never again gave her tinned dog food 😉
And another vote for dogs in elk — if you haven’t read it – do so at once but be careful of drinking while reading. If you have read it – read it again just because 😉
-eva
R.K. says
My yorkie-poo (stop laughing!) buries his feces just like you describe, except he only does it when he goes on his indoor potty mat. I’ve seen him actually flip the potty mat over his feces, but he usually just pushes his nose towards it in a perfect circle, mimicking the motion of covering it with dirt. I always thought it was so bizarre!! Maybe I will try to get a video of it.
Lynette Watson says
Not unique to Carolina Dogs. Dingoes do all these behaviors. Snout pits – and teach their young to do this as well. Like Brisbin can never figure out what it is they eat from these pits, and have only ever found soil in the mouth and teeth immediately following. Thought at first it may be earth worms. It occurs in the southern hemisphere between July and November, when earth is soft or at least damp.
When off territory or changing den enclosures the faeces are covered by use of the nose as described. They also pee in water, rather than leave a trace of scent. I am reasonably sure that is what it is about – territory. Marking openly on familiar held territory, and hiding all trace of presence otherwise.
I certainly agree that no primitive or semi primitive dog should be sold via a pet outlet. They are definitely not for the inexperienced.
aren DeBraal says
I have 4 dogs from a northeastern NM shelter. They are of varied ancestry and all of them like to make little snout holes and eat I know not what. I thought it might be grass roots but why and why then — I live in Oregon now and grass is everywhere. Maybe some grub? Can’t believe they are lacking in any nutrients — they have varied and excellent diets. It isn’t common that this happens and sometimes it is on a walk.
I live in an area with a sizable homeless population and we find human feces in the alleys. I have twice had the misfortune of cleaning this off my dogs. I would pick anything else to clean off. But found peppermint Dr. Bronner’s did the job for this.
Used to have a pet-sitting business and took care of 2 Basenjis. I loved them. They moved like wild animals. I never let them off leash. They were well trained but had minds of their own — not too worried about what I wanted.I would bring them over to an elderly professor’s house to visit as he had lived in Africa and loved to watch them loose in his huge yard. They would flow like water over stumps and plantings, etc. They would sing as I drove up. The owner told me they would start minutes before I pulled up. They despised having the tiniest drop of urine on themselves and would frantically lick it off.
Great post! Great responses! I too am unable to re-read Ol Yeller. It affects me that much.
Karen DeBraal says
And my name is Karen not aren.
Rissa says
Our dog Luke makes snoutprints. In the summer he nibbles holes in the dirt in the lawn, eating something we haven’t identified yet. Worm castings? In the winter, he pushes his whole face into the snow, smelling something we think. When he emerges, there is a perfect imprint of his face in the snow, up to his ears sometimes.
He is part hound and part lobster (found in a lobster crate on the side of the road when he was a puppy), so no help with what breed might do this!
LC says
We have 2, 13 year old male Basenjis. It’s like having 2, 3 year old toddlers in the house. They are mischievous, full of energy and absolute nut balls. One is fear agressive with other dogs and has been so since he was attacked at the age of 3. The other is mildly interested in other dogs but only one a good day. They both are super eager to meet other humans and receive pets but not so fond of the UPS man. They have zero recall and therefore, can’t be off leash. They are loyal… as long as you have a treat. And the earlier post was correct, they come into heat once per year, like most ancient breeds. We have never seen them bury poop with their nose. They do what most dogs do, they scratch to cover it with dirt.
I also did want to mention that we saw a Discovery Channel program on the Amazon. They they described the eating habits of the Macaws where they ate some fruit or nut that contained toxins. They then flew to cliffs with red clay and ingested that which in turn, neutralized the toxins. Maybe the dogs are eating the sand for a similar purpose?
Linda N says
With the exception of the ears (my guys are more lab-ish) this looks just like my Harvey right down to the ‘stripe’ across his shoulders. But those eyes are definitely Harvey eyes. It’s one of the first things commented on when people see his photos. Once when he was waiting in the car I returned to find a woman and her son checking him out. The little boy was excited to tell his mom this was just the kind of dog he wanted and the mom just kept saying ‘wow, what soulful eyes’. Harvey learned everything he needed to in obedience but does only what he chooses. And I have never had a dog as attached to me as he is.
Anne C. says
I have to agree that NOTHING smells as bad or is as nauseating as pig “s–t.” When I worked in veterinary pharmaceutical development I could enter and work in any animal barn, cow, chicken, turkey, but even entering a pig farm made me want to be sick. I hope Willie is beginning to smell better.
DanaD says
I have what I think is a Blackmouth Cur, though someone recently just asked me if she was a dingo. She makes snout pits when we go to the beach – sand up her nose for miles. And though she attempts to bury her feces by kicking, she does bury her bones with her nose in a semi-circle. It seems very ritualized because some of her snout pushes don’t even touch the bone itself. It is like she is building up the area around it (even if it is just on a flat surface with no dirt around to push) and covering it.
Jo Lynne York says
Old Yeller was a Blackmouth Cur. If Carolina Dogs were in that general swampy area in the late 19th century, it’s unlikely they would be found in the Texas Hill Country which is where Gipson set Old Yeller.
Kat says
http://www.flickr.com/photos/33350160@N02/6808940481/in/set-72157627938760349/ Trishsa, this is the best photo I could find showing Finna’s shape. She was surrendered to the Humane Society by the animal hoarders that raised her or to put it another way who took pity on a homeless puppy and brought her home to be raised by their pack of dogs since they were too overwhelmed with too many dogs to spend time with her. The paperwork they filled out listed her parentage as GSD/Corgi and it’s consistent with her looks–Corgi-ish face, GSD ears and marking but I don’t know how accurate it really is, since I don’t know if her previous people knew her parents or not.
Finna is a very independent dog and she doesn’t like strangers at all. She adores me, and really likes the children but still isn’t always comfortable with my husband. I’ve attributed these characteristics to her breed mix and her utter lack of socialization (I had to teach her how to play with a person and how to cuddle). The fact that she is all drive and determination I’ve also attributed to her mix of breeds. She’s scary smart. Staying one step ahead of her is a constant challenge. She loves training and learns fast but doesn’t always remember what she’s learned when confronted with the unexpected. She’s highly reactive to almost anything novel or unpredictable. I find it easy to sympathize with those living with more primitive breeds but I don’t think that she is genetically more primitive so much as socially more primitive if that makes sense.
Kat says
Trisha, This is completely off topic but I don’t know how better to share this with you and it seems like something you’d find as interesting a I did. I put the whole thing in my blog so it’ probably easiest just to give you the link. http://rangerandhiskat.blogspot.com/2013/09/if-you-were-puppy-just-coming-to-your.html I’m privileged to work with some amazing and pretty articulate kids.
Margaret Duclos says
Great post! I have a particular interest in ancient and primitive dogs.
My Siberian Husky buries his feces with his nose, he has done this since he was 8 or 10 weeks old. He does NOT do it all the time, or often. He used to do it more when he was younger. In fact, I had not seen him do it in years (he is almost 7) until just this week. Though the yard we had when he was a puppy was mostly dirt, and now we only have grass.
He also buries food with his nose (whether there is anything to actually cover it or not!)
And he prefers to poop up on things, like in a bush or up on a mound of grass. I have seen only 1 or 2 other dogs do this “leg lift” type defecation.
In at least 1 DNA study, Siberian Huskies are believed to be an ancient breed, one of a few most closely related to wolves.
My australian shepherd digs down a bit (with his paws) and eats soil a lot at the dog park.. I have no clue why..
Colleen Falconer says
Well, this is timely! I just moved across state and, sadly, my female basenji was none too happy about being crated for the entire length of the drive; she subsequently peed in her crate (she hasn’t done that since puppyhood!). I happened to glance back at her while I was driving and noticed that she was trying to bury the pee spot with her nose. This was the first time I ever observed this behavior from her, and she’s nearly 9 years old. My male basenji has done this a few times as well, although it is quite rare.
Jackie D says
I think it is a mistake to assume that primitive behaviours means that the dog is descended from a primitive breed. (Sorry if somebody has already said this, i did skim some of the comments.)
I have a semi-feral BCx?spaniel. I am certain that there is no Carolina Dog, dingo, coyote, or other primitive breed in him. (We are from the UK, for a start). He was feral from about 8-12 months, possibly longer; I suspect he was bred on a working farm in a shed or yard and never really had human contact.
So – neophobia yes (Arrg! There’s a dead flower on the path today! I can’t walk past that!) , fear of strangers yes (and he never really acclimatises to anyone even after years of regular, positive exposure) , dog aggression yes, hiding when pooping yes, uncomfortable with petting even from us yes, can’t cope with pressure (if I understand you correctly) yes, high prey drive yes, catching things yes.
Burying faeces with snout no (though he does bury prey and bones with his snout), independent no, ‘untrainable’ most definitely not, killing things no (he just carries them around until they die or I rescue them), reproductive behaviour unknown.
I think that zero socialisation and the need to survive in the wild brought out those ‘primitive’ behaviours in him. I suspect with a better upbringing he would have had a typical slightly nervy border collie personality with spaniel ears.
Danielle says
My Alaskan malamute would sometimes try to carefully push grass and dirt over her stool from when she was about 6 months old to a year, and one or more of her siblings did, too. Now at 7, she’s quite satisfied to leave a big exposed pile two feet from the edge of the patio 🙂
Silvia Jay says
I have a feral born mutt from a reserve outside of Calgary who makes dirt pits with one paw and eats I don’t know what, every day once a day, at one certain spot in our yard. Very ritualized.
Mireille says
on the subject of burying with nose, I just could not resist posting this video of a malamute lady we occasionally walk with: http://youtu.be/ltzbRGfprPU
In het beginning she is VERY clear to Spot (my siberian) that this is HER patch of muddy ground to bury her nose in, thank you very much 😉
Spot has recently started burying bones and treat, only when Shadow is not there so that when Shad returns they can have a fight over it (sigh… the joys of two young male siblings in one household). He only started doing this recently, after a rather serious fight that we had to break up and which which co-incides with a power struggle between the two guys. Spot seems to be winning..
Andrea says
I have now owned 6 Basenjis over the past 20 or so years. I have seen the nose bury, but it is somewhat context specific. I’ve never seen it happen with dirt, only soft substrate, such as leaves, grass trimmings, bedding or other loose things (we don’t live where the dogs have the opportunity to “go” on sand). I’ve had 4 girls and 2 boys and not observed a male doing this, but the girls most certainly.
In fact, I’m sure it had to be a nose bury, when my first girl wrapped a turd in my shirt and stuffed it under a desk in the house. I didn’t see it, but I found my turtleneck on the floor jammed in a tight spot and yanked it out wondering WTH? Imagine my surprise when poop fell out of the bundle. (My male at the time barely pooped in the yard, much less inside the house so I’d be a monkey’s uncle if it were him.)
Andrea says
And just to sort of underscore what Liz and Lisa said, my Basenjis are very friendly with people they know, but strangers on the street? Eh. They are highly prey driven and extremely bright. They are very into food so that helps with training but they do get bored easily – no mindless repetition, please. Once they get it right we stop and do something else.
My youngest is starting in Agility and I’ve noticed that movement is a BIG thing for her. As Liz said, pulling on her path, rather than using pressure is key. She loves the big long straight aways. We’re doing Rally too and when training a heel, for this dog at least, food rewards were okay but it’s really all about forward movement. So using that was really instrumental.
Any kind of physical molding…. Just don’t. And if you want to piss them off, go ahead and use P+. At least that’s been my finding. (FWIW, my dogs are no/extremely low % African import.)
They are fun, bright little dogs. I have found that it’s not a “Master and Trusty Dog” relationship, but a partnership that we form. There has been a lot of give and take in building fun, meaningful friendships with these dogs. They are for me.
Jill says
We have a Carolina Dog that apparently had never had human contact. It took four months to catch her. We are in a “hot spot” for CD’s, in North Texas. We recently found another, a black and tan and shipped her to a CD foster in GA. We didn’t know what a CD was until we got Molly. I am a dog rescuer and had posted pictures of her. It opened up a whole new world. She is amazing, but soooo very different. We had six other dogs when she came to live with us (finally) in June. She integrated very well into the pack. Still not knowing what she was, we noticed her gait cycle is different (think Arabian horse), she was digging snout holes, just a lot of very different behavior than any other dog we’d ever had. She is extremely bonded to my daughter, who was the one that worked with her daily, for 4 months. It took several weeks before she would really let me touch her much. She is extremely smart, almost too smart for her own good. She has never had an accident in the house, learned “shake” in a matter of days. She can jump vertically, about 4 feet, from a standing position. Last week we had deer across our back fence. She had the chain link in her teeth, growling and shaking it. She does cover her poop and can dig a trench as well as any tiller! Her ears rotate like crazy, like little individual radars. She is getting to be quite the snuggler now. We absolutely love her! We have another one, found in the same area, that we are now trying to find a home for.
Cori says
I also have a wild caught Carolina Dog. She was caught when she was 3 months old. i got her from a rescue when she was 6 months old and still very wild. i started fostering her, fell in love and adopted. We did’t find out for a few months what she is. She’s now 1 year old.They are very different from other dogs. Very smart! She integrated very well into my existing pack of 4 but it took weeks for her to allow anyone to approach her. She’s still very skittish around most people. She digs snout pits all the time, we’re constantly covering them up. She does not bury her own poop, instead she buries the poop of the other dogs if she thinks it’s not where it belongs after she carries it back where she thinks it should be.
Anna says
I have a neighbor with a dog that could be a Carolina dog or at least seems to have some Carolina dog in her. She looks like the dog in the picture maybe slightly lighter in color. The owner brought her from Florida where she was abandoned as a puppy with two of her litter mates. She is very skittish, independent, seems to be scared of most other dogs, has tonnes of energy and is very attached to her family.
As to covering feces, my mini schnauzer does that sometimes in winter. He would use his nose to cover them with snow. He also likes to “bury” his bones: he would carefully fold the towel around the bone with his nose, then push on the mound as if he wants to flatten it. He’d then walk away only to return in a minute or two to uncover his treasure and eat it.
Alexandra says
My Labrador Retriever and my Border Collie both dig little pits in the ground with their noses and eat who knows what from the dirt. It looks like they eat the dirt for some reason. Not really sure why, but the Lab started it and the BC, I think, learned it from him. My lab-mix does not do this, but she’s generally more dignified than the boys.
lauri GOODE says
I do live with a dingo CD American Dingo in my observance he is exactly like the Australian Dingo,I also have a new guinea singing dog and I love them both so much .I learn from them every day .,they are raised as natural as I can fed on a complete and hugh varity raw diet as they would in the wild.,nosodes instead of vaccines .they are amazing.
Trisha says
To Mihaela: Sorry, I just can’t imagine ever saying that dogs give “17 signs of warning before biting.” I don’t believe that myself, so ever with my swiss cheese memory I am sure someone else must have said it. (Although I do agree that dogs usually give lots of warning signals before biting that often are ignored or not perceived.)
Your comments are just fascinating: So far it looks as though individuals of several different (and relatively unrelated) breeds of dogs have been observed burying feces with their nose. The one which caused my ears to prick forward they practically said BONG as if in a cartoon was the Doxie/Yorkie cross. Gotta love it.
What appears to be consistent with many of the breeds we think of as “ancient” is a tendency to be independent and high prey drive. If you look at the comments you’ll see some are neophobic, but some are quite bold, so I’m guessing that there is a lot of variability in that trait. (There is a lot of variability in the shy/bold continuum in many species of wild animals; I’m thinking here of the primates that Steve Suomi studied, who have about 10% of the population, consistently, categorized as “shy.”) Thus, Jackie D, I agree completely that neophobia and shyness should not be considered a “primitive” behavior. If so, I must have an interesting set of genetics, because I was so shy as a young adult I could barely look anyone in the face.
Thanks to Rolly for a link to information about the genetics of Kelpies. The link is a text, promo really, of the documentary (as Rolly described), and it worked on me: I’m suckered in and want to watch it.
And thanks Sasha for the additional information about Korean Jindos. That is another breed I have had little experience with (much less than with Shiba Inus). I love the phrase “sun circles.” Tell your Shiba that I appreciate his cleanliness. Willie’s anointment in pig s— would clearly have appalled him.
The comments about dogs from Native American reservations are all also so interesting. I agree that many of the dogs have had little inference in their breeding, besides natural selection of course. That brings up another interesting issue raised by Carolina Dogs: If CDs are a breed or genetic line that exists because of a lack of human interference, how can it be maintained by a breeding program run by humans? The issue is so circular I feel like my head is beginning to start spinning around in circles every time I think about it. Of course, that brings up the entire massive issue of “What is a breed,” which is a complicated topic best dealt with in another post.
I did read the Dogs in Elk story and absolutely cracked up. I have no problem that it is word-for-word true. If others haven’t read it yet (go to earlier comments and follow the link). Just don’t expect to order an Elk Doghouse from LL Bean any time soon!
Kat, thanks for the photo of Finna, I love “meeting her.” She does look a bit GSD’y and Corgi-ish too, if we can agree to pretend that those are actually words. And I agree absolutely that shyness and reactivity aren’t restricted to ancient or primitive or non-European breeds. (Have I mentioned how lucky Finna is to have you? She sounds killer smart and always challenging. What a lucky girl she is.) And I absolutely loved the story of Ranger and the kids. Thanks for sharing it.
Mittsy says
My dog, Bindi, is a “camp dog”, part Kelpie, part Australian staffy are my best guess, based on the area of Australia she came from. When I lived in Rockhampton, QLD, some residents of the Woorabinda Tribal Lands brought several puppies into town because their camp dog population was getting out of hand. At 3 months of age, she was handed over to a foster carer who had a big heart but few skills. At 7 1/2 months of age, she was so difficult for the foster carer to handle that the rescue called me in desperation.
She is hands-down the most intelligent dog I’ve ever met. She has classic dingo, kelpie and staffy characteristics: kelpie ears, staffy barrel chest and heart-shaped face, and slender dingo legs. The only way I could effectively tire her when she was 8 months old was to walk her all the way down a 1-mile beach, throwing her ball far into the surf so she’d have to swim out to get it, retrieve, repeat, for the length of the beach and back. When we had a party, she played a 9-hour game of fetch, with 2 breaks.
I brought her with me when I returned to Wisconsin in 2007. She’s now 10, and still dispatches all rabbits who dare enter my yard with ease. She is entirely unsafe around cats, and always has been, so we don’t have any. She lifts her leg higher than any male dog I’ve ever met to urine mark every chance she gets. She has been known to pee on the head of my rat terrier.
Although she never lets a day go by without rolling in something fun, she is oddly tidy – she allows all of the water to drip from her mouth before walking away from the water bowl. My Australian friends described that as a kelpie trait when I noticed it for the first time.
And she is the undisputed love of my life.
Riikka says
Never heard of Carolina Dogs, but they look lovely.
I’ve only ever met one dog who covered his faeces using his nose. Funnily enough this dog isn’t from an ancient breed, but a male Miniature Schnauzer.
Ben says
My first comment never showed up either.
Another awesome post, as usual. Fascinating stuff.
What do you guys think about dog temperament/behaviour/personality differences between regular, non ancient breeds? Obviously there are exceptions and stuff to such broad rules, if they exist. But most dog books I read say that no such differences exist. I don’t have nearly enough personal experience to draw from without having a laughable sample size. But I can’t always trust studies where I don’t have time to read about methodology, etc.
So are there really breeds that generally (again, this is on average, there will be exceptions to any rule) are smarter? That generally are more easily trained? Better with kids? Etc etc
Kelly Schlesinger says
Our daughter’s first activity in FFA was with a pig she named Otis. Since we live in the suburbs, Otis lived at the high school FFA barn, which was only accessible by car. And my daughter shared my car with me. So I became quite familiar with the piggy smells and agree that there is nothing like the odor of pig s@#t. I hope you have gotten it off Willy!
Joe Pepin says
Our GSD mix used to dig a shallow hole in the lawn and lick the dirt. Could he be replenishing his intestinal bacteria with soil bacteria?
Robin Jackson says
@Ben,
Absolutely, there are behavioural breed traits that vary from one breed to another–that was the point of most of the original breeding, after all! It wasn’t about looks. But that just means statistically you’re more likely to see those traits in that breed–there are still individuals of any breed who are outliers.
Statistically some breeds are more likely to be touch or sound sensitive, some are more territorial, some have higher prey drive. No one trait is “better” than another, and there are always individuals in any breed with a less common set of traits–but some traits do work better in specific environments.
There are many good references that discuss the various typical breed traits. I personally like the yourpurebredpuppy.com site for a quick online overview of many different breeds:
http://www.yourpurebredpuppy.com/dogbreeds/
but others may have other favourite references.
It’s interesting to note that in semi-rural areas with dogs who work on farms, border collie rescue organisations tend to find that about half the dogs who are surrendered come from working farms where they are considered too low drive to work effectively, and the other half come from suburban homes where they are considered too high drive or too sound sensitive for the family’s lifestyle. And yes, often the dogs can be swapped with good success. Both are good dogs, but they have specific traits that make them better suited to one lifestyle or another.
Some breeds are typically much more territorial or protective than others, and the protective ones can be problematic in a household with young children. They may do very well with the kids in that family, but when you have kids, you also have other people’s kids visiting, and that can be difficult with a protective dog. Other breeds are typically hopelessly inept as guard dogs precisely because they do like everybody. These breeds are often very good in a suburban family lifestyle.
So while there are no guarantees, and there will always be some dumb border collies, wary labs, and gregarious akitas, most breeds were designed for a specific behavioural profile, and statistically a majority of individuals of that breed will tend to fit that profile.
Robin J.
p.s. The sad exception is when a working breed becomes very popular as a pet (often because of a book or movie) and you suddenly get a large number of profit-oriented breeders breeding for looks alone. The cocker spaniel went through this in the US, and now you have to look really hard to find ones with the original cheerful resilient temperament. You’ll find this caveat in some breed descriptions.
Beth with the Corgis says
Kat, to me Finna looks more like a Cattle Dog mix. I could be wrong. The dwarf leg trait, to the best of my understanding, is a dominant gene with incomplete penetrance; I would expect to see less leg if she had a substantial amount of Corgi in her. The head shape looks more heeler to me too.
My own guess would be heeler/coonhound or some such mix. I can see some dwarfing in the shape of the leg, but various dwarfing genes are found across all of dogdom.
We know a Basenji. I would call him clever, independent, and very sure of his own ability to get on in the world. He is very dog-friendly with our dogs, but I don’t know him well enough to know if he is like this with all dogs, or if he just is fond of ours. Jack at least is a favorite among most dogs. The Basenji seems relatively unconcerned with the goings-on of humans.
Beth with the Corgis says
I just remembered: we once met a Corgi/ German Shepherd cross. The parentage was known; a purebred dog escaped and met another purebred dog that lived nearby.
The dog looked exactly like a pure black undocked Corgi, spitz tail and all. It was the size of a Corgi, shape of a Corgi, weight of a Corgi, and had a Corgi coat. It had the short legs. The only thing it seems to have gotten from the GSD side was the black color gene.
I do realize mixes aren’t predictable. It’s worth considering, though, that a German Shepherd head and Corgi head are very similar except for size. Finna’s head shape is what makes me think Cattle Dog, though it could just be the angle of the pic. She is very pretty! 🙂
Beth with the Corgis says
I wanted to address the question of why the Carolina dogs’ genes have not intermingled with domestic dogs. There are two possibilities:
One is the same reason that you don’t see coyotes’ gene pool being adulterated with dog genes, even though the two can indeed successfully breed: with only one parent to read the pups, most matings between male dogs and female coyotes do not usually result in puppies that reach adulthood. If by chance they do reach adulthood, the chances of them having the behavior traits needed to survive on their own are slim. Matings between male coyotes and female dogs may or may not result in pups that survive long enough to have proper homes, but regardless those genes would end up widely diluted into the pet dog population, not the coyote population. I would suspect similar issues with free-ranging Carolina dogs mating with domestic dogs.
The other reason is mating preference. Many species of birds could technically cross-breed, but highly ritualized mating behaviors keep them from doing so; the males and females simply can’t speak the same mating “language” to get the deed done. There is a biological term for self-selection giving rise to different species, but I can’t recall it.
My guess is that most domestic dogs don’t speak the right courtship language to successfully mate with true free-ranging Carolina dogs.
Amy Samida says
I read with interest about the Carolina Dogs covering their feces.
I have a small dog day care facility. One of my visitors is a twelve year old dog that was adopted from the shelter in Ann Arbor, MI. She appears to be a beagle x sheltie, but that’s totally a guess. She does this! She will go to the gravel area of the yard, poop. then go in circles using her nose to completely cover it. It’s pretty fascinating. I’ve never seen a dog do this, but she is very careful to make sure it’s covered. It takes a few minutes and she will scoop gravel with her snout as she is circling, then check her progress. I’ve tried to catch it on video but she’s pretty crafty about pooping when no one is watching and then, if you do catch her, no matter how subtle you try to be, she notices you are taping and quits. I’m going to keep trying. I’ll get her one of these days!
Kat says
@Beth w/ Corgis, All I really know is that Finna’s surrender paperwork said, GSD/Corgi. Interestingly both her veterinarian’s immediately said Cattle Dog when they first met her and I agree that, especially, in photographs, she looks very similar to a cattle dog. I figure she’s pure 100% unsocialized, reactive, super-smart, all drive mutt. She’s clearly a herder from her behavior but that fits with all the guesses about her genetics so isn’t much help.
Our trainer, who raises working line GSDs, is constantly pointing out behaviors and characteristics that she says are clearly GSD I see what she means. And living with her I often see the turn of a head, profile, curled up posture, etc., that reminds me strongly of Corgis I know. I’m less concerned with the exact nature of her genetic mix than with doing the best I can, by the dog she is–a dog that was profoundly damaged by lack of socialization and handling in her formative years. I agree, too, that she’s a pretty dog especially when she’s not acting like the psycho bitch from hell some thing that thank the Good Lord is occurring with less and less frequency.
Cathy W. says
A long time reader from down-under who loves your blog! Dingos come in the following colours sandy-yellow, red-ginger and occasionally black and tan, white or black. I’ve seen the black and tans at a local wildlife park and they look like Kelpies. If interested the following book is a sourse of information: ‘The Dingo in Australia and Asia’ by Laurie Corbett Published 1995 by the University of New South Wales Press Ltd.
JM says
Beth with the Corgis,
Reading the link below it looks like CDs have 3 estrus cycles per year and come from a geographically isolated area.
http://www.carolinadogs.com/smithsonian.html
So I suspect they may be breeding among themselves because of geographical isolation not behavioral reasons. I would venture to guess they would breed quite well with ‘other dogs. I have not seen it stated anywhere that they wont breed well with other dogs. So I am not sure your coyote or bird example would quite fit the CD situation if they will breed with other dogs given the chance.
Also the article says…
“Brisbin is cautious in interpreting the results, especially since the mtDNA sequences of some domestic dogs also grouped with the Carolinas at the base of the tree. “It’s interesting that at a preliminary stage, most all of the Carolina dogs turned out to be primitive” — but so did boxers, German shepherds and Labrador” retrievers,”
It seems to me that they are not at all a ‘breed’. Breed in my opinion implies human selective breeding and/or culling Rather they are a pariah dog from a geographical isolated area and some may not have pure breed ancestors. I often wonder how many other ‘mixed breed’ dogs are not actually mixed breed dogs but in fact no breed at all. When the DNA testing is perfected we will know for sure. CDs seem to offer some interesting possibilities for study, but don’t seem to offer much new for the pet market. I wonder just what the people who are breeding CDs are exactly selecting for? Nothing much that I can figure out from my searching except to appeal to people who want something ‘new’ or ‘rare’ or looks like a dingo. Shelters already to have many dingo-looking dogs available.
Ben says
Robin:
Hey thanks for the reply.
All very interesting stuff.
I thought a lot of the modern breeds were introduced in the victorian era and it was just for looks? But I guess even then you can’t really just control for looks without affecting behaviour.
Ah, thats sad about the Cocker Spaniel. Too many sad things in the dog breeding world (too many irresponsible breeders).
Again, thanks for sharing the info!
LisaW says
@Kat: Sounds to me that the thanks for Finna’s improvements really go to you and all the hard work and smart rehab (mental and physical) in all the right places you’ve been doing. From one who knows, and isn’t as well-timed as you seem to be, it’s not for the faint of heart. Nice work.
Beth with the Corgis says
Ben, while there is some truth to dog breeds being refined for looks based on the Victorian dog show world (which has continued to the present day), most breeds were developed for a job: hunting, herding/guarding flocks, ratting, draft work, lap dog, or property guardian were the major groupings.
Every dog is an individual, but go out in the woods with most beagle pups and they will run off after a scent, while most herding dogs will keep a close eye on their people. Most guarding dogs are discriminating with strangers as they mature while most pack dogs are not, etc. So while there are more show- or pet-bred Goldens than hunting lines, it’s still hard to find a golden that won’t carry something in her mouth for hours, given half a chance.
Robin Jackson says
@Ben,
All 10 of the most popular purebred breeds in the US in 2012 started out as working dogs, with a huge variety in form to fit their different intended functions.
Labradors are water retrievers. Beagles are scent trackers. Bulldogs were fighters. Rottweilers were drover’s dogs, used for both herding and guarding. Dachshunds were bred to hunt in burrows against both badgers and rats. Many people are unaware that standard poodles were originally hunting dogs, and some breeders still breed working lines for that purpose. Even yorkies were originally working dogs, bred small to work as ratters in urban buildings, particularly mills. You have to get down to #11, the shi Tzu, to find a breed created solely as companion.
http://www.akc.org/reg/dogreg_stats.cfm
But over time as the original functions are less used, dogs may well be bred for looks, diluting the original behavioural profile.
@JM,
There is no standard scientific definition of “breed,” and the US and UK philosophies differ, even down to the dictionary definition. Webster’s (US) includes the “developed by humans” verbiage, but the Oxford English Dictionary (OED) says a breed is “a line of descendants perpetuating particular hereditary qualities.” US definitions almost always include “selective breeding,” but UK definitions don’t, or say “typically,” allowing for breeds that developed less intentionally.
The AKC and The Kennel Club (UK) have different breed standards, recognise a different number of breeds, and group breeds differently.
Golden Retrievers are a good example. Current DNA tests would show them to be the same, but a number of breeders consider English Golden Retrievers and US Golden Retrievers to now be two separate breeds. It’s not just a matter of more colours being accepted in the UK standard–the toplines are different, with the American dogs having a slope from front to back that is unacceptable in the UK standard. And the ears are literally in a different place.
http://www.brightongoldens.com/AboutGoldens.html
So in the dog world, a “breed” is whatever you can get one of the established registries to accept as a “breeds true” standard. And the registries quite often disagree.
In the more general scientific literature, “breed” doesn’t have a definition at all.
To go back to Darwin’s terms, Carolina Dogs would certainly seem to qualify as a “variety,” with or without intentional human selection.
Respectfully,
Robin J.
Beth with the Corgis says
Kat, I agree that Finna’s ancestry does not really matter (though lots of people are curious when they have mixes). It strikes me as interesting that your husband says the Carolina dog looks like her, because Carolina dogs look a lot like Dingos, and Australian Cattle Dogs look a lot like Dingos.
Also, Aus Cattle Dogs tend to be very independent, forceful dogs who require tons of socialization not to be a bit, er, difficult…. They can be hard to place, so lots of rescues are reluctant to put that label on a dog if they can help it (though you said she came from hoarders).
She looks 3/4 cattle dog to me, and your descriptions of her behavior sound very cattle-doggy too.
But again, it’s who she is now that’s important.
Amber Rowland says
My dog Sadie (some kind of cattle dog/terrier/cur dog mix?) shows a lot of “primitive dog” behaviors, including incredible scavenging and foraging skills and an INTENSE love of grubs. She’ll come RUNNING if I find a Japanese Beetle grub while gardening and call out “grub-grub!” She crunches them down like the little jewels of dense protein that they are, and she’ll hunt for them on her own if she smells them in disturbed or soft soil. My suspicion is that snout-pits may have more to do with extra foraging while grubs are fattening in the ground over the winter months in the South than having to do specifically with breeding… I’ve never tried SMELLING a grub myself, but it’s pretty clear from Sadie’s behavior that she CAN detect them by scent through several inches of soil.
Wild Dingo says
What a great post. Dingoes are close to my heart. I had a half GSD half dingo, who was my husband’s dog first then mine when we married. When she passed on, I wanted one JUST like her and searched high and low. I found Carolina dogs and desperately wanted one, but the breeder I found was less than desirable. No return policy. Not that I wanted to return my dog. I just love knowing that my dog has an “ultimate home” should I become dead or incapacitated! Even my rescued dogs have this. So I was a bit put off by that in her contract. I never did get an American Dingo (Carolina dog). HOwever the dog I did FIND, who looked a lot like my GSD/dingo mix happens to be a “feral” /non domestic dog, if you will. He is a GSD mixed with Formosan Mountain Dog. Formosan dogs are sometimes called Tugo or Taiwanese Mt. Dogs. They are decedents of the South Asian hunting dog (Pariah dog). They have HIGH prey drive, high protection drive, and very good hunting skills. They are extremely suspicious dogs, and very protective. When I first rescued my dog (Loki) I had to do a lot of work to get him to relax and accept “normal” things (bike riders, people pulling luggage, roller bladders, you name it, he barked at it). I’ve had him over 5 years now and he’s 6.5 years old. I adopted him at about 1.5 years of age, he had come from Taiwan because his owner ditched him on the side of a road. He’d found his way home only to be left outside and not fed. He was rescued by a neighbor who couldn’t believe his “loyalty” to a human who treated him so badly. He came to the US, by then, a complete mess behaviorally. Four homes couldn’t handle him and he was only 1 years old! He was mouthy and bossy and anxious and aggressive. But I wanted him and we worked hard and worked through so much. The first trainer I had was afraid of him. The second trainer told me to get rid of him. Another trainer happened to witness his “over” protection or insanely high protection drive and basically educated me really quickly on what it was like to be in his brain. From there on in, it was easy-peasy to work with him. I simply spoke softly and carried a LOT of treats. I always praised/thanked him for alerting me. I conditioned him around everything that was normal with my classic “machine gun treat” feeding until he could be around ANYTHING and be just calm as can be. I took this dog, who was anxious, overly protective and just out of his mind at times and MOVED to another country (from NorCal to Switzerland) with him and back again! I still marvel at how I accomplished this. I took him hiking in the alps and into the Gondola down the mountains which he would NEVER do years ago, as I couldn’t get him on an escalator. (while my sibe on the other hand would prance up and down the escalators, just fine as nothing was wrong). We developed a little system, accidentally actually, when he gets nervous he looks at me. I stay calm and reach for the treats. Like a chain smoker, but it’s all good by me. Over the years he’s needed less and less treats. But in the beginning of our living in Switzerland, we couldn’t get within 500 feet of cows or horses and now I don’t even need to keep him in a strict heel position, he’s allowed to pass freely as long as he ignores which he does because he’s calm. To this day, I still marvel at all the hard work it was and how far we’ve come. For all the cyclists he aggressively barked at in the first year I had him, he now rides with me in the mountains 2x/week both off-leash or connected to bikejor leash line. I would never imagined him being able to do that, he was THAT out of control around fast moving people back then. Now, he politely ignores every cyclist who passes us even on crazy busy weekends on the trails. I love having a “protection” dog like this because when the threat is real, his alerts are completely accurate and justified. Especially when I ride by myself, I love having him with me. It’s a huge comfort. This summer, he alerted twice in ways I have never seen him act. Once to an intruder by our fence line (we live in the mountains in CA but it was not wildlife as we have tons of deer fencing, so it was likely a person who should not have been there at midnight) and the second was at 5 a.m. to a FIRE that started in OUR detached garage, that we would have NEVER heard. In 10 minutes, our garage would have blown up from all the gas powered equipment, two cars, and flammable materials in it. Our dog, HEARD it from our bedroom window and woke us up alerting in a way that was not “oh its a coyote” or “oh it’s a skunk.” It was severe and threatening and he wanted to get out to the threat and get to it. we saw the fire start and were able to put it out.
This dog saved us 100’s of thousands of dollars in damage, maybe even our lives. This dog, who one trainer was afraid of and one trainer told me to get rid of. And if you’re questioning that this was just a noise he alerted to, I can tell you that few years ago, our house alarm went off in the middle of the night, he never got out of bed. The alarm is ear-piercing and can be hear for miles across the mountain range. I had to make him do a perimeter check with me. It was a failed window magnet. Even with the loud alarm, he just knew there was no real threat. One other time while living in Switzerland, I left a door open from the house to the garden (wide open) and went to bed forgetting to shut it. He did not let me go to bed, he got up and pointed me to the stairs to go down and look. I found the door open, shut it and he went finally went to bed himself. This is what it’s like to have a dog that is hyper alert/protective. There’s pro’s and con’s. The pro’s are times like this. The con’s are times like wanting to hike a trail and EVERYONE is a threat! It takes a lot to work through but you get there.
Dogs that are primitive or feral, especially ones that are suspicious, they take a special kind of handler. That person has to be completely committed. My husband could never do this though he loves this dog, he would never have the time to think about what it would take to reach his brain and to help him through his anxieties. His “mouthy” behavior that so many foster people were afraid of, turned out to be an asset. He loves to tug which was a great training motivator. Taught him what was appropriate for teeth and what wasn’t and never had an issue since. Tugging was also an excellent anxiety reliever, like a baby pacifier at times!
It doesn’t help that his primitive Formosan half is mixed with GSD, both being suspicious and alert. It’s almost as if that suspicious gene wasn’t halved but doubled in him. I know a lot of GSD’s less suspicious than he is. But either way, it doesn’t matter in the end. I think like any other type of breed, domestic or primitive, once you understand it’s genetics, motivations, drives, that’s half the battle. The other half is making the time to think about how to handle behavior change (or in some cases behavior management) from there. Sometimes I think half his problem was someone just “validating” that what he sees sometimes is “out of the norm” whether that thing is “normal for us” or “not normal and a real threat.” Because of all of that validating, he’s become such a calmer dog overall. He’s still suspicious, and rightly so for his breed. But now just so much more solid and confident.
I wish I had known what I know today about dogs like him when I had my dingo. I worked with her starting at 8 years old (she had zero training) and we achieved a lot but I think would have achieved more had I known about marker training, classical conditioning techniques with dogs, for HER protective issues at home.
BTW: my other dog is a Siberian Husky, which is completely different “mind” wise from my GSD-Formosan. I love her pieces for the exact opposite reasons of why I love my GSD Formosan!
I do love Carolina dogs though and would have loved to own one. Having had a dog like Loki, I think I would probably be able to handle one today. Maybe. 🙂
Mihaela Onciu says
Hi, again, Trisha! I am sorry, definitely wouldn’t want to attribute to you anything that you didn’t say (and that’s why I asked…). This was a seminar that you gave with Steve White. He presented the (famous?) video of the TV reported that gets bit in the face by the police K-9 right in front of the cameras, then replayed it for us to watch all the warning signs given by the German Shephard before the actual bite, and then (I think) he stated that in some study (?) dogs gave an average number of X warning signs before proceeding to biting. But if you are not aware of any specific study to support that, I’ll just let it go…. I hope I won’t upset Steve White now…
JJ says
Wild Dingo: Thank you for sharing all of that information. You helped to give me an appreciation for that kind of dog.
Ruth says
I have both a New Guinea Singing Dog and a Tibetan Mastiff. I can honestly say I’ve never seen either attempt to bury their poop, BUT, I don’t recall either ever having a chance to poop on sand or other loose dirt like that either. Our yard (and the other places we’ve taken them) all have hard packed dirt.
Singers are….different, to an extreme more than the CD. We’ve socialized Arty to an extreme, and yet he’s only stranger friendly if you have food (then he’s your new best friend!). If you don’t have food he acts skittish, in a way that would have most “doggy folks” thinking “he’s abused”. GIven a chance he’s highly distructive (we’ve MOSTLY managed to redirect that towards appropriate outlets), and HIGHLY prey driven. When it comes to “fight or flight” he’s definetly a “flight” sort of dog, but don’t corner him or attempt to restrain him without I or my husband present because he WILL defend himself. And since they’re as flexible as a cat your chances of being able to keep him from connecting is very small. Arty can litterally turn his head and look back down his spine, he can grab that hand on his scruff like its nothing.
And speaking of “warning signs before biting” Tibetan Mastiffs do NOT display the same warning signs, their body language is MUCH more subtle, and chances are you will NEVER see those warnings if you don’t know how to read the breed!
dia says
I have just run across this blog, while looking for information on African Village dogs. I live in Canada, but have been granted a lovely dog, from Egypt near the Red Sea, and I’m fascinated by the differences I see in him compared to the domesticated dogs I’m used to. He’s independent, very wary of new things, and does not like strangers at all, though seems quite happy with his two people. He is extremely fast when off-leash, but quite a couch potato in the house.
When I read your post about the Carolina dogs who dig “nose pits” and who cover up feces with their nose, I was surprised, as my dog uses his nose to dig in snow, sand, loose dirt and grass. I’ve even seen him attempt to “cover” feces using his nose, though he doesn’t do this often. Perhaps if I found sand for him to do his business, he would?
He also will not eliminate – pee or poop – in the yard, and for his first two years he seemed to take care to only poop where it wouldn’t be found. But as he matured, he’s reversed that policy and now makes considerable effort to tear up the ground near by – I’ve offered to buy him spray paint, if it would help.
Anyway, this perhaps goes into the For What It’s Worth category. 🙂
dia says
Wild Dingo,
I loved your story about Loki, so much reminds me of my dog. He was born feral, but rescued at around 6 weeks, and lived with my sister and her husband till he came to me in Canada. I had no clue about what to do with him, and many times I despaired! After three years with us, he has still only let me and my BF touch him; he doesn’t go into any building but my house (God forbid I should ever move!), and for a long time he was extremely reactive to practically everything. Before I got him, I thought treats were a poor way to train dogs; after working with him for a while, I realize there’s not much else I can do – he could care less about toys, and although he’s quite bonded with me, he’s also convinced that he needs to keep a close eye on everything, even if I do have the best treat in the world. I do notice in the last few months, however, that he’s beginning to look at me more often when he’s unsure, so another step. I love him to death, and still trying to figure him out, and it’s nice to read about someone who’s been through it.
jennifer britton parkhurst says
MY CAROLINA DOG FRED INSPIRED ME THIS: The ochre project is an international collaborative artistic effort to bring awareness conservation and change for the dingoes of australia and ban the use of 1080 poison. the poisons remains in the carcasses and seeps into the earth destroying the ecosystem. the dingo is the australian indigenous peoples totem. this project was sparked by the killing of a young dingo. its remains were not returned to the Butchulla.
the dingoes in australia are in need of immediate support. they are not protected and being poisoned. please visit this project to bring awareness change and preservation to the dingoes and ban the use of 1080. please help any way you can. please let me know either way. thank you! these are 3 ways: https://www.facebook.com/events/234543566675729/?ref=ts&fref=ts
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/863/711/057/ban-1080-poison-baits-and-the-practice-of-baiting-dingos-in-australia/?cid=FB_TAF
https://www.facebook.com/events/587225967959588/?ref=ts&fref=ts
please watch these videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0CBXHIpY-A&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0D-3budd1aI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G3m1dXk-Jc
PLEASE SHARE THIS PRESS RELEASE:
http://www.sbwire.com/press-releases/us-company-makes-poison-to-kill-australian-dingoes-271988.htm
thank you so much. jennifer britton parkhurst. nyc
theochreproject.com
released yesterday: http://www.examiner.com/article/the-ochre-project-raising-awareness-of-the-dingo-cull-part-i
http://www.examiner.com/article/the-ochre-project-raising-awareness-of-the-dingo-cull-part-ii
our pamphlet thank you enviroprint australia: http://www.enviro-print.com.au/Pdfs/ProjectPDFs/DINGO-AUSTRALIA%27S_GUARDIAN_&_LION_KING.pdf
the ochre project has supporters from at least 58 countries.
the ochre project is fiscally sponsored by the center for contemporary environmental arts
http://environmentalartcenter.org/
dlockert says
Trisha, I have no contribution on the subject of ancient breeds. I can only say that I met you many years ago in Toledo and in my head I can hear you say “She really is a lovely, lovely cow.” Having grown up on a farm, I can confirm that cows are often quite lovely – so glad you got to spend a little time with Louise and save her from a very bad accident most likely.
Rachel says
I have a 2 year old Canaan dog. I noticed another reader named Rachel has one as well.
Tika is not an easy dog to own. She is absolutely bonded to me and my family deeply. But that also has made her overprotective and territorial. She doesn’t like strangers entering our house and this is a problem that we constantly have to work on. I have used your Cautious Canine methods and they help but it will always be a work in progress I suspect. She has a warning bark that will absolutely make your hair curl. It is so loud and piercing.
She is very reactive. She has been difficult to train because of her incredible independence and natural wariness. She can learn a command in a second but getting her to sit-stay when new stimulus is presented is nearly impossible but we keep working on it. She is not food motivated and is highly suspicious of anything new.
She dumps her kibble on the ground out the bowl as she prefers to “forage” for her dinner. She covers her feces, although not in the manner you described. She digs holes in a second — her paws move so fast they are a blur. She bounds when she runs sometimes — leaping along. When she is in full throttle running, she is easily the fastest dog I have ever seen.
She is also nocturnal. If allowed, she likes to sleep all morning long and then can come awake at 5:00pm to begin her day and insists on playing then.
She will curl up into the tiniest ball when cold — her nose under her behind. And in our bedroom, if she is hot, she will go under the curtains to hide away.
Given a bone, she will always bury it in the exact same fashion, nosing grass out of the way and covering it. She does this even in the house where there is no grass. Just nosing at blankets until she is satisfied that it’s covered adequately. Then later, she goes to “dig” it up. I have found many half-chewed bones under bed pillows in the house.
I think there is a lot of advertising of Canaan dogs as good family dogs currently. We bought her under this premise. I think there is not enough information from breeders about the real challenges and drawbacks of bringing ancient dogs into a domestic home. Tika is coming along but it’s very slow as we go against her natural instincts and ancient DNA to make her a good family pet.
Shelly says
Just like other primitive dogs ( dingo, Canaan Dog etc), Carolina dogs still has the primitive and nocturnal instinct. These dogs need a lot of daily exercise as their energy level is high. It is always advisable to socialize them in young age.
Sherry Barnsley says
I believe we might have a Carolina Dog or at least something mixed with a Carolina Dog. Our dog, Hazel, is a rescue dog who was born in Tennessee in July, 2012. She certainly has looks of a Carolina dog. We’ve taken her to two sessions of Dog’s Best Friend training classes. I’d love for you to see her to see if you think that is what she might be. We live in Madison, Wisconsin.
r s roberts says
fascinating information. Where could I find a list of all the types of dog that come into oestrus only once a year.
J. H. Gray says
We think we also have a carolina dog, her name is Hazel because when she was a pup she had hazel green eyes but now they are golden. She looks pretty much like the picture at the top of the article but she is a bit bigger, she is almost 3 and 66 lbs as of last week.
She is the best pet we could hope for but the first 18 months were rough. She was a rescue dog and we received her when she was about 8 weeks old, kind of shy and intense food aggression. My wife worked her tail off with training and socializing, she has the scars to prove it. Now she is fantastic with people and kids, very affectionate and great with other dogs as long as she is not on a leash. She does have some serious leash aggression if the other dog does anything but walk on by. She is getting better but we are still working on it. She is an indoor dog and fully house/crate trained. She has plenty of toys and really good about chewing anything in the house. We have a dog park in town that Hazel attends once in a while but she makes weekly trips to a doggie day care. The owner was concerned when she was a pup telling us she could be a problem but she is one of her favorites now since she gets along with others so well.
If you can make the commitment to work with them when they are young, they make fantastic pets/family members.
http://www.sodapop.org/hazel
Bob Lionel says
We have a 5 year old dog that by all accounts seems to be a Carolina dog. Brodie was a horrible puppy and was black and white, looking very much like a young husky. As he’s gotten older the mask is gone off his face and he’s almost white with a slight ruddy red/brown dusting and freckles on his face/head. He’s very social. He has never met a stranger, but he’s also very protective. Gets along with any other dog unless it moves in to quickly which will immediately put him in defensive/aggressive mode. He loves attention, wants to sit by you. Loves to ride in the truck, but will paw at you for attention while doing so. He digs snout pits and appears to eat something from the ground and at least once I’ve caught him eating a grub. He’s very object oriented and collects things. He will rearrange pillows to make a “nest”. He will gather up my shoes into a single place and lay on them. He will also take objects outside and hide them (not fun walking around the backyard with a flashlight looking for the DVR remote!)
Oh yeah he loves to jump:
http://offcamber.smugmug.com/My-Dogs/Erwin-Park-June-21/i-XQFKmCx/0/X2/untitled%20shoot-038-X2.jpg
http://offcamber.smugmug.com/My-Dogs/12-18-Processed/i-GJwLmDP/0/X3/12-04-11-2-X3.jpg
Dave Wuest says
I have a 5 year old female Carolina dog I adopted from the Newark NJ Humane Society. I am 57 and have had and been around dogs my whole life. “Lucy” is the smartest canine I have ever seen. She does have 2 personalities… a puppy and what at times appears to be wolf. VERY fast. Anticipates animal movements, scents, and is very protective of me. When I got her as a 3 month old puppy, I had trouble training her. I brought my trainer in who had just retired from 30 years with the FBI Canine unit. As soon as he walked in the house he said what I thought was a white Shepard mutt was a Carolina dog and determined she “spoke” Spanish. He taught her the basic commands plus “friend”, “protect” and “attack”. I must give the “friend” command when she meets you. Even my grown kids who are part of the “pack”, but do not live with me, can not yell at me or hit me, even fooling around. She turns into the wolf. She is 65 lbs., but has the strength of 120 lbs. + You can view her on UTUBE… “Lucy the Carolina dog in NJ”. luv my Lucy
Patricia Gleason says
I had a 50 pound yellow dog with medium length wiry hair and prick ears for many years, who, based on the behaviors described, may have had some Carolina dog in her, though her hair texture was not smooth but more like fishing line. She looked more like what a giant Cairn Terrier with a long tail might look like, if one existed. She did not make snout pits but would meticulously bury her feces using her nose, but usually ONLY if it was diarrhea. I always figured it was some kind of instinctual disease control ritual. She also hunted mice by pouncing like a fox,and her temperament was gentle, if somewhat aloof with people she did not know and generally independent. She very rarely barked, but would ‘talk’ in a sort of growl/low, slow howl if she wanted something. Basically she was the cutest thing that ever lived. 🙂 She was a stray adopted from a shelter in Northern New Jersey; no idea of her background. She lived to be somewhere between 15-17 years old. (Age unknown at time of adoption, but thought to be around 2 – though to me, she seemed older than that when first adopted based on her behavior.) Miss my Kelly girl.
Marisa says
I have a 1.5 year old Caroling Dog and she’s bright, independent, and a total wild child… but not a bit shy. She’s the most fearless, outgoing dog I’ve ever met. When she was 9 weeks old we lived next to a fire station (so constant sirens) and my boyfriend and roommate would bike to work wearing helmets and reflective gear and flashing lights headlamps, and she wasn’t afraid of any of it. She loves humans of all shapes and sizes and always has.
When she was a baby she didn’t like to be touched or petted very much, but she’s gotten used to it as she’s grown older and will cuddle up to me when she’s sleepy. She needs loads of exercise to keep her happy, digs snout pits, and will bury her feces if she’s on top of loose or sandy soil.
She does have a couple of other quirks I wonder if other Carolina or primitive dog owners have noticed. For instance, she gets quite aggressive if we try to put anything around her torso — much more so than other, more domestic dogs I’ve seen. She’ll let me pick her up, hug her, but if I wrap something around her (say an ace bandage or a thunder shirt) she gets very close to biting. I have the same reaction with her paws. I can touch them and play with them with my hands, but if I try to touch them with an object (nail clippers, a toy, a pencil) she gets very aggressive.
Has anyone else had these issues?
Katie says
We adopted a dog from a shelter in Central Illinois and were told she was a german shepherd mix. My brother stumbled upon the CD online and she fits the physical and behavioral traits to a T. I emailed some pictures of her to Dr. Brisbin and he said she was lovely =). She is VERY intelligent. We worked with a trainer right after we adopted her at 1.5 years old and the trainer said she learned and mastered more in 2 hours than most do in a week of sessions. She is miss personality. She is very curious yet very cautious. She is also always keeping her eye on me. I think she would eat someone who tried to hurt me. The CDs also do not smell like dog. They have no odor to them which is nice. She is very high energy and will just go and go an go. Her prey drive is something else which is common in the CD since they are a wild breed. She loves people and kids too! She is currently doing her chewy jabber at me which means she need sto go to the bathroom. The breed is great! I recommend to anyone! They are challenging but worth every single minute!
Mike says
We rescued a 3 month old puppy, she is 6 months now. Appears to be a carolina dog (ginger / markings / ears pointed,/ etc…She is very sweet and smart. Loves people especially women (look , there’s a sister!) She does like to dig at various places in the yard, and does create “snout holes” by pulling up grass in various spots which fit her snout perfectly. She minds well, loves to play, isn’t destructive, and is submissive to and gets along well with our 5 yr old male Lasa Apso (spelling?). Great addition to our pack.
Sam says
I am the lucky owner of a Carolina dog. She was found in upstate SC running loose as a puppy about 8 – 10 weeks old. I believe she got separated from her mother and litter I had no clue of what breed she was until much later. I was doing some research online there was a picture of a Carolina dog and I immediately recognized my own Annie. She is one of the most amazing dogs I have ever owned and in my life there have been many both purebred and mutts. She exhibits all the traits of a Carolina dog in terms of size color and snout holes in the yard. However, some of the comments here make me wonder about some of the other dogs people talking about. She has no problems with people or other dogs and is very intelligent and loving. Perhaps because I got her so young and she was socialized early but I have noticed she has hunting skills I have never seen exhibited in any of my other dogs. If she sees a prey such as a bird or mouse and in one case a possum she is locked on and will wait as long as it takes stalking and then pounce on it usually catching her prey. I have had other dogs that would let a rodent run right by them and never move. She is strong willed and sometimes stubborn but mostly she fits in well. Annie’s health is excellent no issues to speak of that can be attributed to her breed she is now 8 years old. My only concern is when she’s gone will I every find one to replace her but I hope that day is many years off.
greg kerr says
Wow! I live near Atlanta Georgia, and today our State DNR put up a post about Carolina Dogs. Curious, I looked it over. After reading the article and looking at the dog pictures, I googled the topic further. It appears our beloved family member named Spice who died in 2009 after more than fifteen years with us, was a Carolina Dog! We got Spice free from a family out in front of a K-Mart who had a large cut down box with thirteen pups in it. At the time the family said that Spice was likely a Shepherd/Golden retriever mix. If I posted her pictures with the Wikipedia ones you’d see they are identical. I am an outdoorsman and bonded strongly with Spice, as did the rest of our family. There were many aspects of her character that left us thinking she had wolf, coyote…or yes, dingo blood in her. She was friendly with other dogs, but an Alpha, and once acquaintance was made, she’d rather just hang with us and forget the other dog. She was very intelligent and I quickly learned she only responded well to strong verbal commands or corrections….she didn’t need, nor would tolerate I might add, say a smack on the snout. She had an amazing sense of smell..she’d be lying down in the living room and suddenly get up and race to the door leading outside and power sniff along the door sill, and sure enough there would be another animal out back. We noticed over time a peculiar trait as well. As her time with us increased she was exposed to extended family and friends. If someone came to the door Spice was always territorial and would act aggressive with barks and what we called a wolf snarl. I’d open the door and have to hold her back and introduce the stranger. Only after a few minutes would Spice relax. Well family visits would prove an exception. We noticed that if a blood relative Spice had never met came to visit, she would often have quit barking by the time we arrived at the door…and if not…she ceased immediately once the door was open and she got a whiff. She would then go right up to the blood relative, sniff, and then lay her head against their leg. This would not hold true for, lets say, a non blood related aunt of a blood related uncle. Everyone who knew Spice well realized there was something very special about her. She was so smart, noble, loyal, protective etc. The most common remarks I would hear spoken about her from strangers were….”what breed is she” (I’d reply mutt, which surprised folks)…or “she looks like a deer”…or “she looks like a coyote”. Knowing she was an actual “real” dog explains so much! In fact she was so special and different I’ve off and on been writing a book about her. She was such a cherished member of the family!
Susan bowman says
Regarding your request for information about dogs covering their feces with their noses, my new pup (about 6 mths old) does this and I cannot find info anywhere on the net about this behavior! The best we can tell just by appearances is that he is a chihuahua/terrier mix. He is a shelter rescue with no breed info. Almost every time he “goes” he slowly and gingerly noses the surrounding grass inward toward the “pile.” He also does it when encountering his old piles as he comes across them in the yard; never does he do this when he finds my other dogs’ remnants. Very interesting!
Chris Kim says
We have a female Carolina Dog named Bella. She is the best dog I’ve had, by a very wide margin. I’ve had shiba inus and an akita, also old dog breeds, but the carolina is both the smartest and most instinct-based by far, That said, she is completely devoted to my wife and I. She doesnt like performing tricks very much, and isnt a people pleaser, but she excels in and adores the hunting and swimming games we have devised. She invents her own games, which was quite a shock. these dogs NEED to feel that they are valuable pack members, and if they do, then they will always do their best for you.
Bonnie says
My 3.5 yr old male german shepard today, for the very first time, used his snout to move leaves onto his pooh ??
Charlene says
I have a Carolina Dog, and I’m quite happy with her for she is a fantastic dog. I’ve had her since she was born (she’s 4 1/2 years old now) and she does really good with young children. She is wary of strangers, but is not aggressive, and eventually warms up to regular visitors. Her mannerisms remind me a lot of coyotes. She has been well socialized and gets along well with a range of other animals from cats to rabbits. She has turned out to be an excellent trail dog and loves to go hiking (these dogs love to have free range and can run for miles without tiring). She has a wonderful temperament and loves to cuddle. When I’m home, she has to be with me at all times. She lays quietly in the kitchen while I cook and will nap on the floor nearby while I’m watching TV. They do require long walks, otherwise they become destructive. I take mine out to the open desert near our house and take her off her leash and let her run. She is quite protective, but not aggressive. I would definitely love to have another one.
Suzanne says
Old ‘Yaller’ was a cur dog. This is a type that includes Black Mouth Curs and Mountain Curs. They are not mutts or mixed breeds but are purpose bred dogs. They are known for being squirrel and varmint dogs, and are excellent all around farm dogs. We had a Tennessee Treeing Brindle, a type of cur dog. If you asked her if she wanted to go kill squirrels she would go mad with joy. She slept in a pile with the cats, thought my son was her soul mate, guarded the house, understood thresholds and could read expressions like an empath.
Susan says
I have a hound/collie mix and she pushes snow with her nose … if the snow is heavy, she will loosen it with her paw and then push it very meticulously like she’s covering something, but I can’t always see whatever she thinks she’s covering, so I’m assuming it’s the scent.
Sherry says
My Siberian Husky buries her fieces with leaves, twigs and snow in winter. Very carefully scooping snow with her nose until completely covered. We would really like to know why, but it is really funny to watch.
Sandie says
I have a male CD that is three years old and absolutely love him. I found him at the Atlanta Humane Society and he had come out of South Carolina. The CD’s have a unique personality. Mine is very friendly and loves to meet people and other dogs. He is very vocal and loves to try and talk with you. He will create snouts holes in the back yard or in the snow. They’re very loyal dogs and family oriented. He has been good around my nieces and small children. I haven’t seen him bury his feces, however I have seen him use his snout to hide bones and food. The first couple of years I had him, he would only go potty if he was behind a tree or bush. I always thought this behavior was an interesting quirk. He also likes to be clean and loves his monthly bath. Everyone that meets him, falls in love with him.
Stephanie J. Little Wolf says
The reason Carolina dogs have Asian DNA is because of all the composite Asian breeds that are included in their heritage. They have no genetic relationship with dogs in the Archeological Record in North America. Ancient NA native dogs are not related to Dingos. Dingos actually are not related to modern dogs at all, with the exception of the Queensland Heeler who have a small bit of Dingo in their origins. Carolina dogs represent one man’s effort to preserver a dog that evidences the natural dog trying to reemerge from what man has tried to assert over it. Throw a dog into the wild and watch it revert. I’m guessing based on my research that you’ll get a long term pariah morph in 20 generations and that is what the Carolina Dog is. It is the modern dog trying to revert back to its original phenotype. Take a couple of Heelers and an Akita or Shiba Innu and watch what happens. I ahve seen it first hand. You get a Coyote in there and wham, a pariah emerges. I seriously doubt these are native dogs of any kind. Its more interesting that there were feral dogs running around that looked like Pariah’s from India where they really do exist. Show me the (nuclear) DNA that prooves they are related to the Archeological record…. Ancient Asian blood is in half the breeds in America or more. Siberian Huskies, Akita, Shiba Inu, etc.
Sarah says
I have what appears to be full blood Carolina Dog, she is the most social friendly dog I have ever seen. My 8 year old loves her and she loves him as well as every person she has ever met. When we come home she frolics and leaps off all 4 feet and goes bonkers. She absolutely loves going to the dog park and we have yet to meet a dog as fast as her. She is loyal except when people leave the dog park and she tries to go with them . . . what is up with that?? She sheds year round and has water resistant fur, making it a pain to bathe her. She likes to wade in the water but not splash or jump in it. She is only afraid of wipes, cardboard boxes and Great Danes. She has a hard time eating dog food we have not found one that does not upset her tummy so we may have to resort to raw diet but we are trying 1 more thing. She is very quiet only speaks on demand but will offer up a grumble or growl when she is playing. Carolina dogs are pack animals and they prefer to sleep with you, sit on your feet and lay on the couch next to you but not touching. She curls up in a dingo doughnut to sleep or lays stretched out on her back. She is very strange, I describe her as a lioness dog because she pounces, swipes her paw at things and crosses her paws like royalty. Absolutely the most amazing dog I have ever met.
Susan Arford says
I am on my second Carolina Dog (American Dingo), and although they had similarities in behavior, their personalities are very different. I took both puppies to Day Care for socialization with other dogs and people – the first was very friendly and out-going, the second very timid and observed only. Both have been red/tan neutered males; very protective and territorial. The first, Nessado, dug the snout pits, and although he didn’t cover poo, he did seem to make geometric patterns in depositing it. My current American Dingo does not do snout pits or anything odd with poo (although he does like to have his butt wiped when done). They are a very cuddly breed, and like to lie against you in bed. Both have had EXTREME dominance problems, and were the worst puppies I ever had!
I have had a variety of breeds, large and small, puppies to rescues, and have never had problems with any of the dogs – until the Carolina Dogs. Both CD’s were shipped to me at 8 weeks from different breeders, with different bloodlines, over nine years apart. The first, Nessado, was very inbred (parents were brother and sister) and had some problems. He was chewing on my fingers the first minute out of the shipping crate. My vet noticed on his first visit (8 wks) that Nessado was staring down his assistant, not even twitching as his shots were given. The vet said to bring him back for neutering anytime and it would help. I lasted 3 ½ months before having him fixed. After having awful trouble training him, I had to take him to a professional trainer who told me, “He has no short-term memory, extreme dominance problems, and has ADHD.) Several times I had to resort to “wild dog” discipline (mostly for biting), where I flipped him on his back, dug my fingers in his belly, and nipped him on the neck and bridge of nose while holding him down and saying, “No Bite!”. The last time had been at 7 months, when he came trotting through the room and halted till I looked up from my book and met his eyes, then he urinated on the floor. After that last disciplining, he gave up, and became a wonderfully loving, super-bonded, and obedient pet, but I could fill a book with the weird things he did.
The current one was much worse, with him wrestling, mauling, and bloodless-biting relentlessly when I got home from work. The “wild dog” discipline easily happening a dozen times an evening until he was a year old. (Long story, but due to an odd situation, he realized that I protected him, and literally changed overnight.) He is now loving, affectionate, and no longer dominant towards me.
I thought the first puppy was a fluke, and may have been due to the inbreeding. After the second one being even worse, with no excuse, I decided will never put myself through that again. (Crying myself to sleep because my puppy hated me; feeling like a dog abuser because of the really tough discipline they needed; never having that cute, cuddly, innocent puppy stage – it just took the fun out of having a puppy.) As adults, they have been great, just like other breeds, but I don’t want to risk having to go through that kind of puppyhood again.
Caroline says
I realize this is a years-old post now, but in case anyone like myself wanders through, here is my Carolina Dog story:
I have a female Carolina Dog that I rescued from a kill shelter in Tennessee two years ago. She is timid and neurotic, has trouble with other dogs (fearful which sometimes becomes fear aggression if not corrected quickly enough; we have worked hard on that behavior and she’s much better now) but she LOVES cats. Not chasing them — she wants to play with them. My two cats don’t have any time for her, but my neighbor in Tennessee had a cat who would come over and play with her. It was adorable. She also tries to make friends with birds. Go figure.
We moved to Florida a year ago and she stopped digging snout pits when we got here, so the snout pit thing might be minerals found in the Appalachian area. Who can say. She doesn’t cover her feces with her nose, but she does kick grass every time she goes, much to the chagrin of my neighbors, I’m sure.
She’s still a bit shy two years after moving in with me, although she’s bonded to the point that my mom tells me when I leave the house she cries for awhile. She is also very aggressive when strangers come to the door, but completely neutral to adults anywhere else. She loves kids.
She’s a strange little dog. Part of it is her breed, I think, but I’m pretty sure she was abused by previous owners as well (she cringes whenever I take out the broom to this day, and she has a mysterious burn on one side of her rump. She was also pretty underweight when I got her.) So that probably plays into her issues as well. Anyway, she’s safe with me now, and while she could never be ‘breed standard’ because her ears are half-fold, I wouldn’t trade her. Would I get another one? If they needed a home. But I think my next dog will be a bit more affectionate. Rosey loves attention, but she’s still shy of asking for it and it has to be on her terms. And she doesn’t care to lie on the couch with me even though she knows she’s allowed and has been encouraged to do so for as long as I’ve had her.
Sam the girl says
Late to the game, as usual…I had a part Carolina part Jindo dog (yes, I’m a Carolina resident, by the way) Now, want to talk independent, wary, strange…here you have it. She was an escape artist worthy of traveling with Geronimo, was a *dog’s dog* not a people’s dog, but extremely loyal, fearless…absolutely mortified (to tears, literally) around small children or strange dogs -dogs I assume she was not sure she could dominate, because control was her middle name. When all three of my dogs were inside, relaxing, laid back, she would simply get up, walk through the room, snap at each dog, nose-to-nose, then back to her area and nap. There was no snuggling with her, humans or other dogs, and one was her own pup: when I rescued her she had an adolescent puppy. You pet her when she “chose” to be petted. Don’t get me wrong, this was the best dog I ever had, but she definitely had her own personality and it was an independent personality, almost feral in nature. Oh, and that “snout pit” thing? When I rescued her I had her spayed immediately. For a time, possibly a year or two on, she did that snout pit thing, then, gradually it faded away. Not sure if the two are related or not. As an aside, when we would take her fishing she learned when checking bait or reeling in – there just MIGHT be something at the other end and she truly became feral. She was oblivious to commands, touching, holding…anything. She focused on the end of that line and if a fish were there she would go wild. She would go in the creek by the house and stand, stomach deep in the water and hold her head under water until I was sure she would pass out. On occasion she would pull her head up with a small fish. She loved to play with them, but never showed interest in eating them. What a dog!
Sonja says
I rescued my Lea on Valentine’s Day this year. She’s all personality and loves kids and adults alike. She’s ginger with really thick fur around her neck and tail..sheds like crazy. She’s short as well..think she’s got some sharpei mixed in there somewhere. She likes to jump up when your walking somewhere and nip at your butt or legs..irritating..but never connects..if you’re standing in a room not walking she’s jumping up and and seems aggressive..I think she takes it as a challenge as alpha..she trys to dominate this pack of humans of hers.. but mama is queen bee and she knows it..she has to be everywhere that I am..anywhere..when I go to work she gets in her bed and just sleeps all day..when I get home she never leaves my side..wants to play with me constantly..everyone else only gets a fraction of that.
She wants to sleep with me every night as well..at my feet for the most part..but loves to cuddle in the morning when I wake up..she’s beyond sweet during those times! When she’s in that mood the licking is extensive and soaking!
As for her potty habit..she only uses pee pads..refuses to go potty anywhere any other animal has EVER gone..and she always uses her snout to fold up the pad when it’s too wet for her to use anymore,which is once..attempts to bury any feces in the pad! The snout pit thing is very often in the couch or bed and if she gets a treat she wants to bury it for a minute and then dig it out with her snouting. She’s very nuch a hunter and her nose never leaves the ground when we’re walking..wants to catch birds and rabbits and cats bad! She loves other dogs tho and wants to play with all she meets! Children are her favorite thing in the world tho! She loves kids and wants to play play play! Another thing related to the snout pit thing is when she wants something from me and I say no or take to long..she nudges me in a very pushy way with that nose! Over and over..Literally pushes me!
One of her more annoying things is when I’m cooking or eating, she jumps up and stratches at your arm or leg and trys to grab the food right off the plate..jumps up a mile when ya get up to put the plate away trying to get it. When the begging is going on in food situations she’ll yawn big enough to whine out loud..like she’s saying PLEASE!! She eats her dog food just fine,just prefers anything else 1st. She has no problem eating bugs or anything that moves either! When she was about 6 mths old she was obsessed with a bird’s nest that was just behind a wall on the porch and tore up the wood to get to it and I think she ate some baby birds as well..she got very sick that day and scared me to death,but nothing like that since,thank God! She’s about to turn 1 in august or september and I’m just hoping that she learns to mind a little better..she’s super intelligent just so stubborn!! But I love my baby girl with all of my heart and soul..she’s the best dog I’ve ever had! She just wants to lead her pack I guess!
Justin says
Great artical. I have an American dingo. For years people would ask me what kind of dog she was or tell me she looks like a dingo . I would some kind of shepard mut. Then one day about 3 years ago I decided to see if there was such a thing as an American dingo. Low and behold there were hundreds of pictures online of her and then it all made sence. Finally I understood why I had the weirdest dog in the world. I got her from the spa when she was a little fluff ball. She was the one in the back of the cage peeing on her self terrified of her situation wgite all the other puppies were begging and locking at the cage. Leave it to me to pick the wierd one in back. At first I couldn’t get nearbher without out her nervous peeing everywhere. Couldn’t pet her because she didn’t want anything to do with anyone. I thought oh great I made a bad decision. Well move forward 3 years and she has stopped peeing everywhere, has never played or never come to me for attention. Anyone who go near her she ducks and runs away. People always said she must have been beaten before I got her. I usually agreed even though I got her very young and nobody had ever hit her. It was easier to use that excuse to than to tell people she doesn’t like you. When she started having her heats dogs would surround my house. They would come for miles for her. But they where never fast enough to catch her. She would be prancing around the yard with 15 random males following her around. So i had her fixed. She was 3 it was a mistake. To tell you the truth I didn’t like her very much then. Then suddenly one day when she was 5 she picked up a toy and brought it to me. I threw it and she brought it back. Then I tried to get it from her and I realized I’M PLAYING WITH MY OWN DOG!!! Things started to change she started sleeping at my feet licking them all night. Which drove me nuts but I figured if that’s the way she wants to show me love I’ll take it. Now chloe is ten. She is my best friend she never leaves my side. It took that dog years to trust me and it was worth it. I could imagine having any other breed. At ten she’s a little more lazy. She stopped catching birds in mid air and the squirrel population has increased. Still to this day nobody can really pet her. Besides children. And she can still out run any dog. When I tell people she is ten they can believe it. Besides her little grey hairs on her face and her slight glazing of her eyes. she doesn’t look or act like a day over 5. My advice if you are thinking about getting a Carolina dog is. DONT. But if you do it will be hard and trying. It’s a wild dog. After she turned 3 is when she kind of became a dog. So u have to have patience. If you make it ypu will have the best dog ypu have ever know. Every where you go people will tell you how beautiful she is. And you will be able to say I earned her trust.
Justin says
I see a lot of comments about pooping. I have no idea if Chloe even poops. In ten years I’ve never seen her poop. Lol. She has a secret spit I guess. I live in Florida and she used to dig pits but she never went to the bathroom in them. She used them as a bed and would sleep in them. I used to leave her outside during the day. Didn’t need a fence she never left her territory. She let one other dog come around a 120 pound blue pit bull. We used to say your boyfriends outside and she would run to the door. One other thing. She used to go roaming sometimes. Which it didn’t bother me because 1 I knew she was smart enough to stay out of the road and 2 there is no animal fast enough to catch her. One loud wise and I would wait. Sometimes 2 – 3 minutes and she would come sprinting up the driveway. When it come to other animals she only likes dogs that are the same color as her. Golden tanish. She loves Cats though. My ex had gotten this adorable apple head chiwawa/ min pin mix and she absolutely hated that thing. But give her a kitten and she acts like a mother to it.
Justin says
Last thing.lol. if I come home smelling like another dog she gets mad at me. You can truly tell she’s disappointed in me for petting another dog. Yesterday my buddy’s ferret jumped into my lap and I petted it for maybe 5 minutes. When I got home she intently smelled my lap and then went into the bedroom in a huff. When it was time for me to lay down she got up and left the room. She’s such a wierdo.
Alicia says
I have a rescue who I later found out is a Carolina Dog. Due to her traumatic past, she does have some fear/anxiety that is unrelated to her breed that has been improving with time.
She does create snout pits like clockwork starting in September. She is extremely loving, affectionate, and loyal. She “huffs” at “intruders” and will warning bark if needed, but will stop if I correct her. Like any dog, it’s important for Carolina Dogs to see you as the pack leader. She likes other dogs and humans, if given time to recognize that they are the “good guys”.
I adopted a second dog which I think is a Carolina Dog/Chihuahua mix. He’s a bit more vocal then my first dog (possibly due to the Chihuahua in him) but shares a lot of the same personality traits as my first dog.
Both are definitely “pack” dogs, but are not typically aggressive towards other dogs or humans, they will typically avoid and attempt to pacify rather then become aggressive. They are also pretty quick to accept other people or dogs into their “pack” – this summer I road tripped with my first dog (didn’t have the second dog yet) and she quickly accepted my parents, my grandparents, my brother and sister and law, friends, etc.
The other strength that they both have is they are very “in tune” with dog behavior signals and will signal each other and other dogs (i.e.: to calm down, to avoid, etc). Pretty fascinating to watch. The downside of this is when we run into what I like to call “socially awkward” dogs who don’t use or understand those signals they do become a bit anxious/uncertain because their signals are not being understood. For example a dog once innocently approached as at the dog park straight on while staring at us which is a “threat”. Both dogs signaled that they meant no harm and just wanted to play and when that didn’t work they tried to signal avoidance. When the other dog didn’t respond and kept coming towards them my first dog became anxious/uncertain and jumped in front of my other dog and bared her teeth at the oncoming dog in defense. This is the first and only time I’ve ever seen that from her and I did correct it and called both of my dogs away.
Overall nothing but positive experiences with Carolina Dogs. I had no idea what Carolina Dogs were until I adopted my first dog and someone asked me “is that a Carolina Dog?” My first dog is a great dog and even my somewhat dog phobic father fell in love with her – I’m hoping my second dog will be the same way (I think he will be!)
F.G.MIDDLEBROOK says
Ole Yellor was a Texas yellow black mouth cur.
Sara Friedrich says
I have been the lucky owner of two wonderful Carolina dogs, Lady, who lived to be about 14 or so (we think she was about 2 when we adopted her and we had her for 12 years), and now, Coco Chanel, who is 3. We got both of them online (Petfinder.com), one from the Florence, SC, area, and the other from Ridgeland, SC. Shelters don’t often know what kind of dogs they are and often call them a Lab mix, or Shepherd mix. Lady was terribly abused before we got her at age 2 – someone even shot her full of BBs. CoCo was an owner surrender as a puppy. Both of them have been the best dogs I have ever had. Lady was very humble and appreciative, and so intelligent. We loved hearing her howl in the car. CoCo is Miss Personality – very social, so very loving all the time, and loves other dogs, cats, and people once she knows they are okay, but she still hasn’t found her singing voice yet. She is very intuitive – she studies my face, my emotions, constantly. At home, she is always by my side, checking on me, lying right beside me now as I type this. Lady used to dig burrows under our shrubbery – I had never seen a dog do that before. And she would hide all her treats elbow-deep in the neighbor’s yard. She was a skilled hunter, and over they years, brought us many squirrels, possums, and even a snake. CoCo is a bit more laid back but loves to chase squirrels and is skilled at recovering moles in the yard. She buries her treats under the pillows on my bed or the couch, and it is so funny how hard she works with her nose to cover the treats. They are the most loyal, intelligent, best dogs I have ever seen, and so beautiful and majestic, and their smiles – this breed truly smiles – will steal your heart. Lady was healthy as a puppy until about 6 months before she passed away at age 14, and CoCo is such a healthy, beautiful dog, who is now 3. Both very protective of the “pack” and our territory (yard). As soon as we lost our dear Lady, I knew we would have to have another CD, and 10 days later, CoCo joined our family. I can’t imagine owning any other breed of dog. They fascinate me and I just wish I had enough space to own my own pack of CDs. 🙂 It is true that they do not have a smell – someone called it “self-cleaning fur”, but both dogs shed/shedded a lot. It’s all ok though – I wouldn’t trade them for any other kind of dog. CoCo is very attached to me as I am the Alpha, but does great at Doggy Day Care and loves being around other dogs. I have never seen her get aggressive to another dog or person – she will usually back away and avoid a confrontation, but not totally submit. CoCo will poop behind the shrubbery and I have seen her scratch grass and leaves over it, but have not seen her cover it using her snout. She digs holes with her snout and brings up grub worms, which she considers a delicacy. She is definitely my heart and has limitless kisses for our entire family, every day.
Gina says
Proud Carolina dog owner here also! Adopted my boy from a no kill shelter in northern Georgia. He was in a group of all white pups with a nursing chi-weenie (chihuahua/dachshund mix). We did not know he was a Carolina dog when we adopted him. He is great! Loving, affectionate, funny, loyal, and protective without being a danger. I have a toddler who can be rough and he will warn but always look to me to intervene and will never hurt anyone. He looks to me for direction always. They are true pack dogs and look to be led. He has been very easy to train. Loves to run, and just be with me always. He does not play fetch at all! It’s actually very funny. I have a boston terrier who loves fetch and he can’t figure out why? He couldn’t be bothered. He pounces like a wolf going after a rabbit that’s ducked into a hole. It’s so cool to see. He does it when we play. Truly a wild dog trait. He hates squirrels! He would eat everyone if I let him. One thing that was difficult was his burrowing when he was a pup. He dug into everything! Potted plants, couches, chairs. He destroyed a lot of things in my home, but we have 3 kids, 2 dogs, a cat and chickens, so we don’t have “nice” things yet. My vet absolutely loves him! He is not antisocial or timid at all of strangers. He does bark like crazy though! He is sooo vocal! He barks at anything that comes within 500 feet of my house. Once I introduce him to visitors and give the approval the barking stops. He will smells them and observe them for a long time. He is protective of my toddler son (my other kid are older teens) and will always stay between him and the newcomer. Carolina dogs are amazing dogs but they are a primitive dog and have true “dog” characteristics. They are great for “dog people” who love dogs for their natural qualities and can work with dogs natural dog behaviors. An owner must know how to relate to their dogs and read their dogs behaviors and signals. Not a dog for inexperienced dog owners. They need a pack leader. I have had dogs my entire life, I really can’t think of a time in my life longer than a few grieving months when I haven’t had a dog. I have had all breeds, sizes, and personalities, and personality goes a long way when it comes to dogs. Each one is different, even within the same breed, and that is always something to keep in mind.
heather says
You need to add a predator section!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
hugh says
I adopted a 7 week old pup from our local shelter about 19 mo’s ago that turned out to be a Carolina Dog/ Dixie Dingo. Shes very bright, playful and protective,and vocal. loves to “play fight” & put her mouth on anyone (human) engaging her that way but doesnt bite down. She respects her place in our household & exercises her need to dominate over our smaller (by 35#’s!) 8 yr old spaniel mix by putting her jaws and mouth over the smaller dogs entire head. Snout pits like clock work Sept thru Jan. retreives fairly well & bounds and pounces upon intercept in retrieve. Shes primarily shiny black with a white chest & socks, she has a gorgeous coat (sheds avg to above avg I guess; I’ve never had a med.-long haired dog that shed before her)) and is probably close to 60# now at her full adult size. Her name is Kit & she’s a handful and requires an above avg. amt. of exercise but shes a great dog overall.
Keith says
I had a rescue dog that I’m sure was Carolina Dog and Shiba Inu mix. Best dog I have ever had. Very loyal! Very obedient! And Very smart!! The only thing I can say about the mix is the Shiba Inu sheds very bad, this is the trait she got from the Shiba. But she was such a good dog you just had to over look it. Learned on her own or from you. We had no idea how many words she knew, but we had to spell in front of her. Didn’t have a fence around our property, but I taught her the boundries and she would not cross them unless I told her she could. One neighbor tried to take her for walks when we were gone once. She wouldn’t leave the property no matter how much he called her. Like I say BEST dog I ever had, best friend I ever had. She amazed me everyday. I have a Bull Mastiff now and I’m looking for another Carolina Dog. I know others on here have said theirs were very timid to strangers. She was not timid at all, but I rescued her from a collage Frat house at about 2 years old. So she had lots of interaction with people. Very loyal, she slept on the floor beside the bed next to me. We would have Elk come in our yard sometimes at night. She would gently wake me to come and watch the Elk with her. I would give anything to have another one just like her!!! AMAZING DOG!!!
MFK says
Only at four in the morning would I consider writing a comment on the internet concerning a subject on which I am no expert, but here it goes.
The only time I ever personally observed or heard of a domestic dog making an effort to bury something using its snout was actually with my own dog when I was a teenager. My younger cousin and I were sitting on the kitchen floor playing with some type of children’s modeling clay-like substance that had a peculiar albeit faint, chemical smell (to humans, anyway). Our family dog, a Manchester terrier, came over in curiosity to inspect our clay. She seemed to be able to tell by a quick glance of the nose that it was not for eating; she actually seemed slightly distressed by its presence. In an almost robotic (instinctive?) manner, she proceeded use her nose to push a towel that was lying beside us on the floor over the figures we had made out of the clay until they were completely covered. One of us would uncover the figures, and she would push the towel over them again with an anxious look on her face. I put some of the clay in my lap, and she swept her snout over my leg in the same motion as if to cover it again. We put the clay back into its container, and she nose-scooted it away from us and into the nearest corner of the room. Even my mom was puzzled. We ended up throwing the stuff away just in case her sensitivity to it might have been indicating some toxic ingredient we didn’t know about.
It made for anecdotal conversation with other pet owners, but no one else seemed to have ever heard of a dog doing such a thing. From what we could infer, these were not possessions nor treats she intended to save for later. The modeling clay wasn’t in her way, she just wanted it gone. In this way, my example may be similar to the Carolina dogs covering their excrement… perhaps? Yet I believe the Manchester originated in England from a cross between a whippet and a scrappy terrier mutt, so I’m not sure how closely this ties them to East Asian genetics.
Nonetheless, there’s my two cents. Lovely blog, I plan to return!
Sharon McKenzie says
“Old Yeller”, in the book written by Fred Gipson, upon which the Disney movie was based, was plainly described as a bobtailed yellow CUR dog, which was typical of the Curs brought into Texas from Louisiana by settlers. The term, “Cur”, does NOT mean a mongrel dog here, but is a family of dogs which are the descendants of the Mastiff-type war dogs brought over by Hernando de Soto and the dogs of the Native Americans that these Alano Mastiffs encountered, so yes, there was some Carolina Dog WAAAAY back there, like in the 1500’s. The Cur family includes many different, but similar breeds, which are jacks-of-all-trades, hunting, guarding, herding, etc. The most common and familiar recognized Cur breed is the Louisiana Catahoula Leopard Dog, also known as a Catahoula Cur, and the Southern Black-Mouthed Cur is a yellow-coated, often bobtailed relative that was developed in Texas from solid-colored dogs of the same ancestry as the Catahoula. “Old Yeller” would have more than likely been a Black-Mouthed Cur, although Catahoulas can be yellowish/fawn and have natural bobtails, too. The dog in the movie was played by a St. Bernard mix that was found in a shelter and trained by Rudd Weatherwas, who is best known as Lassie’s trainer. I have both Catahoulas and Carolina Dogs, by the way, and they are very different canines.
Heather says
Just found this article when I was searching for info on dogs burying their feces. Our “new” 10 year old female Aussie did this in the first snow of the year, covering it with her snout and even rolling it a few inches away. I think it may be in part because she had to poop closer to the dominate dog’s pile in the smaller cleared off area, not at all in her usual area. Will be interesting to see if it continues.
Michael says
Our 2 1/2 year old rescue buries her poop with her snout. Her “spot” is covered with tan bark, she buries her poop most of the time – pretty high pile, too. Twice she has also buried her “yak stick” treat in with her poop. She does not dig snout pits at all though. She is all black, one little white spot on her chest, 80 pounds, pretty certain she has a lot of shepherd in her, she does that a lot, especially to smaller, furry dogs (like sheep). She is very skittish, scared of new people, but once she knows you, loves women, children, and all other dogs – is a big time kisser, likes to lick both dog and human faces, she is often scared around men, even ones she already knows. She hates the water – loves the beach, just won’t go near the water, and hates taking her shower – and reacts very poorly to loud sounds of all types. Goes crazy barking when someone comes to the door, but loves to meet both people and dogs out on the trail or at the dog park. We figure she is a mix of many things. We found your blog when we googled “dogs that bury their poop with their nose” – have never seen that one before!
Stef Strosky says
All of our past Keeshonden have done the snout pit thing in snow; my new Kees pup Gibbs has not broken that trend. But he is the first to cover his poop with snow. A behavior which only started last week (he will be 6 months old on 2/15/2016). This link https://youtu.be/wcztJ6SRm_Y
is to a video I took of him doing this tonight.
Now we are waiting to see if he will also cover up our 10 year old lab/Pitt bull mixes.
Carol Niedfeldt says
Our Carolina makes nose hole and seasonally eats the mole cricketts that we have. She also digs up moles in much up the same way giving us a couple of snake-looking trails in our yard.
Mary Harris says
I adopted a dog from South Carolina and was told he was a shepherd mix but looks very much like the Carolina dog/Dingo or the Jindo. His temperament is excellent and is very shy with people he doesn’t know. There is one strange thing that he does that I have never seen any other dog do…he will dig up the yard for rocks and then he plays with them instead of all the toys we have bought. Also I forgot to mention above he is very loyal to me and follows me everywhere. Im home all day so my days are used to having someone with them most of the time.
Kim Low says
I have a 15 year old CD who I am completely in love with! Thomas was rescued, literally off a street while trying to live on some woman’s porch. After asking if the pup (approx. 12 wks) was hers, she said “No, he’s been here for 3 days and I don’t want him (slamming door)” I took him home, named him Tommy, cleaned him up, vaxed him, and never looked back. I remember not being all too fond of him initially. He had very little interest in people and was pretty aloof. As he grew, we bonded, and he still kept some aloofness. I found he didn’t really care where I as at or what I was doing…. so long as he knew where I was. LOL If I was gone or away, I always heard back from my mom that he paced, sighed, waited by the door.
I didn’t even know what I had until I was working as a vet assistant and took him to work and the vet asked if I knew what I had. He showed me a picture of my dog! I was ecstatic! Now, 15 years later, after working with me while I was a trainer at a PetSmart, volunteering at a couple of nursing homes (Thomas loves him some elderly people), a husband, 2 kids, 3 deployments …. I am so in love with him. Yeah, his recall always kinda sucked, no he didn’t wanna be my distance running buddy, but I learned to listen and appreciate his very independent personality and needs. He has forever changed me as a trainer, and a person. I can only hope that if I have the opportunity to get another CD, I can have an equally beautifully souled companion as Thomas has been.
Jim McGowan says
I’ve had a Thai Dingo for a bit over 10 years now, I got her as a puppy in Thailand. She has killed too many monocled cobras around our house in Thailand to count. She has traveled with us to California for the past three years now. She grew up as an alpha female pack dog, the adjustment has taken time. She doesn’t want a problem, but if a dog get’s in her face, she has them by the back of the neck in a second. We keep her on a harness when walking, some seem to think leash laws don’t apply to them. We ask the other person to please put their dog on their leash. We have been laughed at when we say I don’t want a problem and your dog will be injured if you don’t. My wife today even picked her up to avoid a fight, then the loose dog scratched her leg. Other dog owner fell trying to scramble to then keep his dog from getting killed. My wife had warned the same guy twice before about leashing his dog and he laughed at her, oh that puppy will do what? She went as far as to show him her teeth, which aren’t like normal dogs. Didn’t listen. He’s on the ground bleeding, my wife’s leg was scratched and he’s lucky my wife saved his loose dog from a big vet bill! Dingos are very fast and will defend their family from anything. Extremely intelligent as well…
David Kovacs says
I’m a Carolina Dog (American Dingo) owner after having Labs my whole life. That said; they are different in many ways. My CD is aloof and skittish around strangers and submissive to other dogs. This is a primitive dog trait as they must gain your trust first. They become very attached to their pack leader and thrive off the pack hierarchy. They are very intelligent and pick up on positive training techniques extremely fast. Hosuebreaking is also very easy due to their intellectual level as well as their nature to be clean dogs who do not like to soil anywhere around their “den”. They make great family dogs who are abundantly loving and aim to please. They are high energy and shed a lot!!! They take an expierenced dog owner who can lead with a good balance of love and discipline.
Jausonne says
Yes other breeds cover their poop and make nose pits. We have had a few different Livestock Guardian breeds, All From Turkey, Kangle and Akbash, that do the same thing. Of course these are both Landrace breeds and for the most part can be described as part feral as the dogs we had/have were 4 or less generations bred in the US. They will also pack down food in holes for hiding and make nose pits. They are sort of like pigs that root and honestly its annoying as they can dig up an area.
Vicki Kea says
My American Indian Dog (indiandogs.com) looks a lot like a Carolina Dog, maybe a little more slender. He makes nose pits in the snow, but he’s not just sniffing around. He gets down to the ground and pulls at the dead grass until he gets to the roots. Then he eats the roots. He also will attempt to “bury” his treats in the house with his nose, with the movement of covering up the treat with dirt or sand. He’ll also dig at dirt until he reveals the roots and then eats them.
Dana S. Chisholm says
WOW! I’m glad I found you – this makes so much sense!!!
When we were living in China we found a tiny puppy fighting for food trying to survive. We took her in, nursed her to health, and then when we moved back home to Southern California we brought her home. Everyone asks us “what she is” – and we guess all the Asian breeds, of course. She looks JUST like your pictures here! But, one day I stopped a person walking a dog because I literally thought they had my dog. Turns out (it was a boy) but they had rescued it from the streets in MEXICO! And a friend doing missions work sent me pictures of street dogs that looked just like Emma on the streets in India. I was beginning to think Emma is just the generic “dog” https://www.facebook.com/EmmaMadeinChina/
People also always say – she would have been eaten if we left her on the streets – which is true. And her behavior, even now, is leary of people and will bolt if a stranger tries to pet her. I even got her a therapy dog when we got back so he would help calm her down. She also is a nervous licker and will lick holes in her skin. I always thought it was because she was basically a feral street dog – but, she couldn’t have been more than three or four weeks old when we found her and bottle fed her to life… so, I couldn’t figure out why she acts kinda like bringing home a wolf or a coyote…but, THIS makes sense! It is her “breed” to be a wild dog – ancient dog – like the New Guinea Singing Dog. THANK YOU!
also: http://kids.sandiegozoo.org/animals/new-guinea-singing-dog
Joanne Hayes says
We have a rescued “Carolina Dog” and understand she was first rescued in the south. Beyond what has already been said about this breed, Lily is inclined to freeze when she enters undergrowth (not dense) through which she can pass. This she does with the slowness and quietness of a cat. I have never heard of this behavior though it can probably be filed under things that feral dogs might do when hunting. And boy, does she shed!
Joanne, in Connecticut
Tessie - NC says
We adopted our Carolina dog at 10 months old – he came from a shelter in SC. I was a little worried about bad habits he may be bringing into our home but I have been so surprised. Other than the digging in the yard, (snout holes and full blown digging) and the chewing. It is good to hear the digging may be a seasonal thing. He’s caught moles, birds and squirrels in our backyard. I attribute (with my fingers crossed) that the chewing is puppy mode. He is just one year old now. He does well with other dogs as well but He is SO strong!!! I agree with Joanne, the shedding is a little more than I have experienced from other breeds. I have teenage kids and he loves them as well as us adults. He needs to know where we are constantly. He is a licker too! He prefers to run loose in our backyard to being on a leash but we are still trying to tame the pulling. I cannot imagine our life without Tucker in it – we are in love!
Trisha says
Please send Tucker to kill the moles in our yard and pasture. I wish I could find a better way to co-exist with them, because they are fascinating animals. But I’m tired of tripping on mounds and tunnel excavations…
Frank Milhous says
Elli was the only female in a litter of four that had been rescued from a kill shelter in Pensacola FL with her mother when we found her in 2013. All the male pups had the tan coloring typical of the Carolina Dog breed, and the mother had the tan color, distinctive body and head shape, scimitar tail, and pointed ears. The rescuer had advertised her as a hound/lab mix, but told me she was certain the mother was a CD. Mom also had apparently had a thing for a beagle, and it appeared Dad’s genes ended up strongest in Elli. She is black and tan with a white chest blaze, though her tail is not beagle colored. Her ears have tried to stick up, but they are too much beagle, and flop down. Her forehead and jaw joint are broad and muscular, but her snout is softer and more beagle like. Her nose, and it’s ability to track a scent, is all beagle.
Elli tolerates most other dogs, but prefers people, though even with them she is usually hesitant at first, then aloof when she accepts them. She adores a couple of women I know, but men, not so much, with the exception of my son and me. She tolerates children, but is wary, and while gentle, not affectionate. She will snuggle when she wants, but withdraws to her own space when she is ready. She loves to fetch and play tug-of-war, but has never chewed anything that wasn’t given to her, and she will not play with a toy which belongs to another dog. She was extremely easy to train and housebreak, and the two times she has had an indoor accident since (both caused by food poisoning) she sought out the tile floor of a guest bathroom. As a pup, she ran through the invisible fence I put up twice (at its lowest setting), and then never again. We put the collar away and turned off the machine in a couple of months. She has an incredible memory, and will sometimes bark at the memory of a raccoon or goose she had seen in the yard. She is very vocal, with a wide range of sounds and expressions she employs in trying to communicate. Her barking is sometimes a little much. She sheds her undercoat twice a year, but does not smell. She likes to be petted, but only on her terms. When she is not ready for it, she will duck under your hand like a cat.
Elli digs snout holes in the sand, but does not nose cover her scat. She does try to cover her food, especially when we have her on a camping trip but even indoors in her normal dining area, and has sometimes rubbed a raw spot on the tip of her nose doing so. She is a skilled hunter. We have a number of squirrel carcasses buried under our house, though she leaves the moles out for me to dispose of. She thought she might want to attack geese, but a gander disabused her of that notion, and now she keeps a respectful distance while barking. She exhibits the jumping and hind legged standing behavior I’ve seen in other hunting wild animals, and she will stalk a squirrel like a cat, hugging the ground and scooting close before attacking. She’s a finicky eater, preferring meat-heavy meals and snacks, and refuses almost all grocery store dog biscuits and treats. When she takes a treat, she will hide it indoors or bury outside. When she rode with me to the bank’s drive through teller, they often gave her dog biscuits, which she would promptly tuck into a corner of the floorboard of my truck. Every time she got in the truck she would check them, but never ate one. I had to throw them out when the bugs got in them, and she seemed perturbed by my action.
I agree with those above who have praised these dogs as pets. You have to understand the feral traits that will sometimes show up, and you have to expect some independence. CDs need exercise, and they are going to bark, so I’m not sure an apartment is a good place for them. We worked to socialize Elli, and she will tolerate other dogs, as long as they don’t push her boundaries, but I would think a prospective owner with other dogs might want to have a couple of trial visits, to see how well the CD does with the pets already resident.
With all of that said, Elli has been the sweetest and smartest of the several dogs I have known, and I wouldn’t hesitate to get another Carolina.
Jennifer Sandy says
I think our dog is this breed. When he puts his nose to the ground here, he comes up with a grub worm to play with! He was a stray we took in. Very wild nature, but good with “his” people. He’s done well with a female dog.
Very intelligent. He put indentions in the doorknob and made himself at home on day one.
Hannah Plemmons says
So, after reading this we have decided that our beloved family member, Darby, is a Carolina dog! Darby is 10 years old and we kind of rescued her from a small town in Spring Creek North Carolina. The owners had a large litter and told us she was a pitbull. We soon learned she was not, but never knew what breed she was until now. She has always made nose pits in the dirt, sand, and snow and makes an odd snorting sound when she does them. She has always been very ritual when using the bathroom, using her snout to cover it, circling it and then would finish with using her back legs to kick up more to cover it. She is simply the best dog ever. She has always been very devoted to this family, especially me. She is incredibly smart and seems to know a lot of what we say and do. She can even open most doors on her own. She is very protective of us and our property . One thing i have noticed, is she does Not get along with other dogs. Its almost like she doesn’t know how to get along with them. So, she has been the only dog in this family of 6. We love her more than anything and would love to hear some feedback and conformation on her breed. Thank you for all of your research and devotion!
Trisha says
Wow, if it walks like a duck! No way to know without genetic testing (which could be fun, but isn’t always accurate with rare breeds), but if she was my dog I’d start calling her a Carolina dog with an asterisk for good friends.
Cat S. says
Does anyone know if research has been done on the little yellow dogs that used to be seen all over the Southwest, and especially in the Navajo nation? They are very much like the descriptions of Carolina Dogs in appearance and behavior. I always thought they were probably throwbacks to some primitive, pre-Eurpoean type, but never thought there’d be any way to know for sure. (I left the region decades ago, before genetic testing was available.)
Holli H says
So I just recently discovered Carolina Dogs and I am convinced that my rescue is one. She was called a Red Heeler (Australian Cattle Dog) Mix by the rescue, but after a LOT of observations of them, I don’t think she is that at all. Googled “Dog Breeds that look like Dingos” because we have been getting that comment a lot lately and up popped the Carolina Dog. It’s HER! And all of the articles I have read sound just like her. I was intrigued reading your description of the snout pits and she definitely does this. I had no idea what she was doing or why. Such a cool breed of dog and am having a great time learning about them!
Roger says
I rescued our companion after she was surrendered and later saved by Last Day Rescue (a wonderful organization). I was told they thought she was part Jack Russell and part Yellow Lab, but I soon discovered she is the “poster child” of a Carolina Dog.
Hannah weighs about 50 lbs and stands about 18″ tall at the shoulder. She is not large of head with sometimes erect and sometimes slightly buttoned ears. She is long-necked with a barrel-shaped body, kind of skinny legs and a hook tail. She has a tan short coat with a white chest blaze and white toes.
She had been in foster or the kennel for almost a year because she was so shy and greated strangers poorly. But it only took a day or so and many, many treats to start a friendship, and over the next couple of months she became very attached to our family. She still remains wary of any strangers and is territorially aggressive. When I first took her home, she would become easily scarred and revert to displays of aggressive flight or fight behavior, so I would have to agree that the breed may not
be suitable for a family with children (teens are OK) or other pets. Hannah’s most breed-identifying behavior is when we take walks she alternates between standing lookout from the highest point she and find, and then, in the hollows, root around with he nose digging it deep into everything.
Kathy says
I rescued a Carolina Dog 5 years ago and he has been a joy to have as apart of my family. I had a Weimaraner for 14 years before Cooper and it was definitely a whole different breed to get use to. The odd things that Cooper does is that he will not poop anywhere near where we regularly use our yard. He will go to a very private place and he doesn’t like his area left dirty. He also will not poop while on his leash, which makes it very hard to have him in an area that isn’t fenced in. Maybe that is out of habit of having his own area, but he will go a few days without going if he has to go on a leash. If I can get him to poop on a leash, it still has to be in a very private place such as a wooded area or being a bush. Is this normal behavior for this breed? Cooper is very leery of people, even children when we are walking and he is on a leash. If he is in an enclosed area such as the dog park, he seems less leery and is always happy to see his other 4 legged friends. Cooper will not chase a ball but he loves small stuffed animals. After reading this article, it makes sense as to why that is now. He is an extremely affectionate dog and loves to cuddle on the sofa and sleeps next to me every night. He doesn’t seem to mind being home alone and has never been destructive in the house but is definitely a digger outside. I really enjoy reading these comments from other CD owners.
Steve Conte says
Our Carolina Dog, Petey has been in our coastal South Carolina home for 4 1/2 years since our beloved 10 year old Pit Bull/Lab, Bear chose him from a line up of rescue dogs. We felt she needed a companion after the kids moved out and build out of the neighborhood made her free roaming problematic. She was an incredible, intelligent dog and we wanted her to “train” our new dog.
Petey was less than a year old but full grown at 43 pounds of happy wildness. We’ve since been told by several vets that he’s got some coyote heritage and are pretty sure that he had been picked up from the wild. He seldom barks but “talks” a lot. On day 2 he stood up and turned the doorknob to open the back door and let himself in. During his first thunderstorm with us he clamored to go OUT, sat on the deck and howled. We had to keep in in a crate whenever we couldn’t watch him because he chewed anything that interested him. He opened any door that wasn’t dead-bolted, tunneled under, tore through or jumped over any fence (and back if Bear couldn’t make it) and generally found a way for him and Bear to get out for a long jaunt nearly every day. I didn’t witness him poop for a months because he hid in the bushes but ultimately discovered that he stands almost straight, lifts a rear leg like he’s scratching his ear and poops on a small bush.
Eventually Bear’s mothering and our training turned Petey into as well behaved a dog as I’ve ever seen. Bear left us last October and Petey mourned for months. He loves running in the woods and, while he used to chase them, now plays with the deer. Now that he’s the only dog he never goes far – a few hundred yards compared to miles. He moves as quiet as a cat, snuggles whenever anyone will let him and only needs a leash where rules require it. Brushing every few days keeps shedding under control along with an occasional hosing when he gets in the mud. He’s filled out to 46 pounds, eats whenever he wants to which isn’t much and drinks very little water. He’ll run on a leash next to my bike for miles, come home and not go to his bowl for hours. Such a sweet, loyal, clever, fun to watch companion! Now we’re beginning to think about getting a new dog for him to teach but not sure if a Carolina Dog would be a good choice. If anyone reads this far and has any experience with introducing a second CD I would appreciate a post with your advice.
Marcia Weber says
I have a pure bread Carolina dog. She doesn’t do nose pits. And she is very very sociable she loves everyone the only time she gets aggressive is if she feels I’m in danger. She is the best dog I’ve ever had and absolutely loves kids and other dogs
Mighty Dog says
What a great read! The Carolina Dogs are certainly an interesting breed to research. I truly believe the mixed lines leads to better health. We are doing way too much inbreeding with pure breeds.
ShalanK says
So I’m pretty positive my dog is a German Shepherd Carolina Dog. I think the family moved up from the south and has multiple fathers in the litter on accident because the parents both looked pure bred even tho the dad was mixed with a little of somerhing else and the puppies all looked different, some even with blue eyes. Anyway. I did a lot of research and came across the. Carolina dog.. Skylar looked just like a mix online so I started reading up on them and found that my dog has almost All of the characteristics of a Carolina dog but barely any of the shepherd. Her back legs are longer, eyeliner eyes, eating dirt and loves digging small holes all over… She buries every thing with her nose till its perfect which is a trait I found when I was potty training her. I’d walk into a room and see a pee pad flipped over so I’d go to pick it up to find she had peed on the mat, pooped next to it, and then covered the poop with the mat. Lol. She’s also extremely agile and has springs for legs. She can jump and grab things 7′ in the air, she’s super quick, and learns very fast so I’ve been doing agility training with her when possible. She’s extremely loving and loyal, and good with everyone but can also be very protective of me or our home. Luckily she’s just acting tough most the time and has never bitten anyone or thing cause she’s such a baby. She has like 5 different barks for different things like looking tough, or when she wants to say hello, or when she wants something and more so it’s easy to know what she’s doing or wants. The most interesting ones are her actual aggression bark and her howl. I’ve only heard the aggressive one twice… Once as a puppy when I woke her from a bad dream and then again when a complete stranger was grabbing her and in her face and he had her trapped… I swore I’d never wake her up again after that cause it scared the **** out of me. Its like this low primal growl, snarl, bark like nothing I’d heard before that can instantly trigger a sense of fear. Her howl is also much lower then most dog howls and it’s eery because it sounds so sad and she does it for only some ambulances like she knows the person inside is hurt or dying. She even looks like a wolf howling at the moon. Skylar is a very vocal dog as u can see and extremely smart. She has a super long snout and tongue that luls out the side of her mouth a lot. Her ears were so big as a puppy people always commented on them and she looked so funny. They’re still big, but she has more hair around her hair to make em look more proportionate. She has amazing hearing and seems like a ground hunter. She pounces and then digs. She sits like a human with her butt on a step or curb or lap and her front paws on the ground in front of her. I think those are most or her prominent features. All in all, Sky is an amazing dog. She senses emotions well so like when I’m sad she licks the tears from my face till I start laughing fighting her off lol. I haven’t been away from her for an entire day since she was 8 weeks old and she’s now almost 2.5 years old. Ive gone thru some very traumatic things in my life so have terrible PTSD that constantly puts my body in flight or fight mode and amps up my anxiety. Having Sky with me helps me feel safe and allows me to be more social plus she loves me unconditionally and would never leave me. Honestly if I didn’t have her, I’d prolly never be able to go anywhere. With her I can take night walks without constantly looking over my shoulder… I don’t jump out of my skin at every sound, I snap outta depressed moods with her goofiness and so much more and shes such a cuddle bug haha. Its so bad when I’m not with her that in order to live my life I trained her and got her certified as an emotional support animal and Im now self training her to be a PTSD service dog. She’s attentive and smart so it hasn’t been too hard and its been so worth it. I have no regrets about getting her and I’m thankful I did; especially during all the trauma and rough times that happened over the past few years. I’m Bipolar and didn’t know it for sure till 2018 when I went thru non stop med trials and almost died from a couple, till they finally decided I’m med resistant and Ive had to handle life on my own since then without self medicating like I did for years denying I had bipolar and couldn’t handle my extreme emotions… I’ve been sober 5.5 years now, including alcohol, except I smoke weed now cause it’s the only thing that helps me stay level. If it hadn’t been for Sky joining my life when she did, I don’t think I’d still be alive today to tell you my story. Honestly I think since she’s mixed with a Carolina dog almost positively, she’s a much more unique and interesting dog then most and also more rare. So I’m grateful every day that I found her without even realizing how special she really was!!
Trisha says
ShalanK: I’m so glad you have Sky! Thanks for telling us about her, and your courage to deal with so much trauma.
Caroline says
I found my Carolina Dog 8 1/2 years ago (when she was around 3) at a kill shelter in Tennessee. She’s got all the traits described above: aloofness with strangers, loving to her pack, enthusiastic creator of nose pits, sometimes burier of treats. She doesn’t bury her feces and she’s not crazy about other dogs (she coexists with a pair of dachshunds but they mostly ignore each other) but she LOVES cats.
The shelter didn’t have any information on her but it was clear she’d been abused before I found her. She’s got a burn mark on one side and she was over 10 pounds underweight, and to this day she still runs whenever I need to get a broom out. She’s very protective of the house as well and I have to be careful with strangers and their dogs. She’s got some wild dog quirks for sure and she has NO idea what to do with toys (the only game she plays is what I call ‘the biting game’, where she get excited and mouths like a puppy, but she never hurts me) but she’s a great dog and an excellent walking companion.
They’re a really healthy breed, though in her old age she’s got some arthritis and she gets those benign warts. Other than that she’s never had any issues. I will definitely seek out the breed again in the future. She barks too much, but the silver lining is that she’s an amazing watch dog.
Denise says
I have a Carolina Dog who is now 12 years old. What we have discovered and researched is that these breeds are fierce pack animals. We adopted Daisy at 7 months from a breeder. When we got her home we found she was very skittish. We discovered it was most likely from ripping her from her pack for at 7 months she was already part of that pack. We had to bring a dog wisperer in to even get her on a leash for walks. She warmed up to us and we became her pack. She shies away from people accept who is in her pack. We adopted a stray (Corgi mix) and Daisy bounded with him right away. They say if you get a Dingo you should make sure you get them as pups. No more than 8-10 weeks due to being pack animals. They desire lots of love and attention but would not trade her for the world. They are very smart. You can see them thinking.
Jerry says
So I have a Carliona dog. I got her from the pound on second chance adaption. She has some very interesting traits unlike any dog I have own before. They are very much a pack dog mentality. Always wants to be include regardless of what we are doing. Doesn’t like to be left alone and doesn’t get depressed, but when I leave on a trip my wife says she will lay on the couch and watch the door until I come home. She does bury her poop with her nose and from what I have read it’s a old trait taught to them. They do this to hide it from prey sp they can’t smell them in the area. She also loves to dig holes for days. She can dig a 3 foot hole in minutes. They do tolerate other dogs, but don’t rrslly care about them. They also have a high prey mentality and want to naturally hunt small game like birds, rabbits, squirrel. They only bark to alert their owners of stuff. They do sing, but it’s more of a high pitch wine when they don’t agree with a command or want it to be known they have opinion. She is very protective of my daughter and sleeps next to her keeping guard at night naturally. We are blessed to have in her in our family, but they take a lot of training. Lastly have more energy then I have ever seen a dog have. Morticia has ran a boxer out of energy to the point he laid down and couldn’t play anymore while she kept jumping over him back and worth waiting for him to recover.
Jo says
More than a decade late to this party.
I’ve had a Carolina dog for 5 years now. He was a rescue and around 5-6 when I got him. He’d been misidentified as a shepherd mix by the rescue I got him from, which is understandable and a common mistake.
I’ve also had 4 Afghan hounds, and known hundreds because I did show grooming, knew many breeders and Afghan owners, and did some showing myself.
Never knew one to bury their feces, and my Carolina dog doesn’t do it either. Also never was told by anyone who had Afghans their dogs did it, and believe me, it would have come up! So I’m not sure where that nugget came from.
Afghans are usually independent, and aloof with strangers. My Carolina dog is independent, but is Mr Social, with people and dogs. I have heard many are standoffish with new people, so mine is one of the outliers.
Since he’s a male, he doesn’t dig snout pits, but I also wonder if whether or not females do relates to the area they’re from. Since Dr Brisbin observed them eating something at the bottoms of the pits, and this was in a specific area of the US, I have to wonder if other females living elsewhere in the country don’t because what they’re after doesn’t exist where they live. Just a theory, I have no evidence either way.
I have and love your book, At the Other End of the Leash. Thank you for your deep understanding of dogs, and sharing it with the world.
Trisha says
Thank you Jo!
Tami says
We adopted our Carolina from a dog rescue about 6 years ago. She was 18 months at the time. We see many of her quirky traits in your article, as well as the comments of others. She creates ‘snout pits’, though we’ve not paid attention to what she’s eating from the depression. She doesn’t generally bury her poo. However, we have seen her occasionally do it when the ground is covered with snow.
Our girl is a homebody who loves her routine. She prefers laying on the deck soaking up the sun to adventures far from home. She is a creature of habit. She tends to nap, beg her daily treat, get her ‘zoomies’, and go to bed at about the same time everyday. When going out into the yard she immediately follows the same path, checking all four corners before she settles into other activities. One time, she herded a guest to the front door when it was bedtime!
She is very pack oriented. She will herd us together if we are not in the same room or outside area. This can extend to family and friends once she has accepted them into our pack. She is most relaxed if we are all laying on the bed or lounging on the sofa with her. However, she is not a snuggler. She enjoys all of us being together, but it must be her decision to lay against or across you. She is be a bit cat-like in her behaviors.
She is wary of strangers and not fond of other dogs. She will bark and whine out of stress. However, if her stress reaches a high level, she will become aggressive. We think part if this is natural instinct and part to her abusive background the rescue organization shared with us. We were her 6th home in 4 different states – 2 of which she was removed by authorities due to abuse.
Our fur baby is definitely different than other dogs we’ve had or known, but we wouldn’t trade our life with her for anything.